Inverter socket - is it rubbish?

[2CV67]

I only use the inverter socket (230v off leisure batteries & limited to 150W) to recharge my camera batteries, so only about once a (holiday) week & for 3 hours & low current (0.2A).
I use a proper (French) plug & use it carefully.

After 50 nights on board (maybe 7 plug-ins max) the socket contacts became very intermittent & VW replaced the socket (& the inverter to which it is apparently attached!)

It then worked perfectly but now (after 109 nights on board) it is back to intermittent.
By intermittent, I mean it depends where/how you position the plug in the socket.
It just feels as if the contacts inside the socket have lost their spring force.

VW are willing to replace the whole lot again under garantee, but we both feel this may not be a permanent solution.
They therefore suggest, and I am agreeing at the moment, replacing the socket by a normal (French) domestic 2-pin socket, surface-mounted on the sink-unit front face.

It is surprising to come to the conclusion that the original socket is not up to the job.

What is anybody else's experience?

Thanks!

 

[Stu]

Ours is at SMG now having the socket/inverter replaced.

 

[smgcowfoldparts]

Have only replaced two inverters in total since T5 California has been out.

cheers

 

[GrannyJen]

Mine has worked perfectly.


So far

 

[2CV67]

My dealer replaced the (second) dodgy 230v socket by a (French) domestic one under garantee:



...presumably saving VW the cost of a new inverter.

I opted for one without a flap for convenience, in spite of the proximity of the sink.
I would have prefered one without the (non-functional) earth pin but I know they are very hard to find these days.
I hope (and expect) that this will now last the life of the vehicle, whereas I would have been doubtful about the original socket, after 2 failures in a short time.

 

[SimplyDubs]

My dealer replaced the (second) dodgy 230v socket by a (French) domestic one under garantee:



...presumably saving VW the cost of a new inverter.

I opted for one without a flap for convenience, in spite of the proximity of the sink.
I would have prefered one without the (non-functional) earth pin but I know they are very hard to find these days.
I hope (and expect) that this will now last the life of the vehicle, whereas I would have been doubtful about the original socket, after 2 failures in a short time.

The original socket is switched... turns the inverter on when items plugged in. (Perhaps this is one of the things that makes it overly complicated)

Was wondering what was done when it was replaced. Is it permanently live? As such it'll continue to draw a current from the leisure batteries... albeit at a low rate due to zero loading on the mains side. (Or have they fitted a separate manual switch?)

Thanks
Mark

 

[Andresz]

My dealer replaced the (second) dodgy 230v socket by a (French) domestic one under garantee:



...presumably saving VW the cost of a new inverter.

I opted for one without a flap for convenience, in spite of the proximity of the sink.
I would have prefered one without the (non-functional) earth pin but I know they are very hard to find these days.
I hope (and expect) that this will now last the life of the vehicle, whereas I would have been doubtful about the original socket, after 2 failures in a short time.

The original socket is switched... turns the inverter on when items plugged in. (Perhaps this is one of the things that makes it overly complicated)

Was wondering what was done when it was replaced. Is it permanently live? As such it'll continue to draw a current from the leisure batteries... albeit at a low rate due to zero loading on the mains side. (Or have they fitted a separate manual switch?)

Thanks
Mark

Or is the inverter sensing the presence of termination via electronic circuit, in that way the external socket would work without any additional modifications..

 

[logyk]

This thread is causing me to question the way I am using the inverter socket.

I leave a plug to which a UK type socket permanently connected to the inverter socket whether the van is in use or not.

Given what I have read in this thread, should I be doing this, are there any serious issues likely to arise ?

To date I have not noticed any problems but I may be missing something.

All comments appreciated.

 

[Andresz]

This thread is causing me to question the way I am using the inverter socket.

I leave a plug to which a UK type socket permanently connected to the inverter socket whether the van is in use or not.

Given what I have read in this thread, should I be doing this, are there any serious issues likely to arise ?

To date I have not noticed any problems but I may be missing something.

All comments appreciated.

You may see the current flow (in Amps) at the Central Panel. If there is any when leaving the plug in, it is better not to do that... The CP itself may cause 0.2 Amps of the current.
Cheers
Andrzej

 

[logyk]

I will check whether the socket is creating a draw .

If there is however, is this necessarily a bad thing - provided the leisure batteries are kept well charged ?

 

[Andresz]

I will check whether the socket is creating a draw .

If there is however, is this necessarily a bad thing - provided the leisure batteries are kept well charged ?

Depending how you use the van, small draw in long term (weeks) may cause problem. Not a problem for daily driver.

 

[logyk]

Thanks Andresz - unless someone comes up with a more serious issue I think I will leave it as it is.

At least the socket itself is not put under any stress by leaving the plug in.

 

[GrannyJen]

My three pin extension socket has been plugged into the inverter continuously since 7th february 2014. I have not removed it since it was first delivered from somewhere (can't remember where, a load of spivs running a forum I think ).

No problems, as andresz says, the draw shown on the control panel is normal, as I never plug in and out it does not come loose, I normally have my Bose mini running on it, or even my slow cooker, (my laptop is charged using a 12v plug, superb piece of kit),

 

[SimplyDubs]

Or is the inverter sensing the presence of termination via electronic circuit, in that way the external socket would work without any additional modifications..

Certainly on mine, the inverter light comes on when an adapter is plugged into the socket... without ant equipment attached, I'm guessing (but it is guessing) it's switched.

Mines a 2009, may well be different on other models.

Zero load current fir most inverters are pretty low, just keen to keep it at zero by not having it on.

Personally don't like leaving things plugged in that aren't being used in the van, use the inverter very infrequently... 12v adapters can be got for most things I use sub 150w and will almost certainly be more efficient.

Jen, Impressed at a slow cooker running off it. You've probably shared details, but I'd been keen to see what there is. Excellent.

 

[2CV67]

The original socket is switched... turns the inverter on when items plugged in. (Perhaps this is one of the things that makes it overly complicated)

Was wondering what was done when it was replaced. Is it permanently live? As such it'll continue to draw a current from the leisure batteries... albeit at a low rate due to zero loading on the mains side. (Or have they fitted a separate manual switch?)

Oh-Oh!

No, they didn't fit any kind of switch.

I just went to check, and the battery level is down to 60% which it never normally reaches (I charge it for 24h once a month when not on the road & it never drops below 80%)...

Does anybody have any good information about the power draw of the inverter with no load?

Do I have to go back & battle with VW to refit a standard set-up?
Or a switch?
I suppose so...

Thank you for pointing out this problem, which I would otherwise only have noticed after damaging the batteries in another few days!

 

[Meoncoast]

Out of intrest I pluged in and left a uk extension plug in for 24hours 0.2 power drawn when the control panel on when control panel on + plug in socket 0.4 showing (amps)

 

[Andresz]

The original socket is switched... turns the inverter on when items plugged in. (Perhaps this is one of the things that makes it overly complicated)

Was wondering what was done when it was replaced. Is it permanently live? As such it'll continue to draw a current from the leisure batteries... albeit at a low rate due to zero loading on the mains side. (Or have they fitted a separate manual switch?)

Oh-Oh!

No, they didn't fit any kind of switch.

I just went to check, and the battery level is down to 60% which it never normally reaches (I charge it for 24h once a month when not on the road & it never drops below 80%)...

Does anybody have any good information about the power draw of the inverter with no load?

Do I have to go back & battle with VW to refit a standard set-up?
Or a switch?
I suppose so...

Thank you for pointing out this problem, which I would otherwise only have noticed after damaging the batteries in another few days!

Check if there is current draw at the display of the central panel.

 

[andywa119]

Always had an extension connected to the inverter socket. Always wondered what the 0.2 Amp drain on the leisure battery was. Removed extension and no current drain reported on panel. 3 years owning a Cali and you learn something new. Thanks


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[2CV67]

Check if there is current draw at the display of the central panel.

Yes, I have been watching it frequently for a couple of days & it always says -0.2amps.

As far as I remember, it usually said 0 before, but I can't go back & check that now...

I think 0.2amp is actually the first graduation step on the device & so can't really be regarded as an accurate measurement.

I would be interested in confirmation of the zero reading from other owners of similar (2013-ish) Cali's.

I would be even more interested in hearing about accurate measurements of current from somebody competent with decent equipment!

In the meantime, I am keeping a daily log of the battery state (volts & %) to see how quickly it drops.
So I can't use the Cali or I need to start all over again!

 

[Andresz]

Check if there is current draw at the display of the central panel.

Yes, I have been watching it frequently for a couple of days & it always says -0.2amps.

As far as I remember, it usually said 0 before, but I can't go back & check that now...

I think 0.2amp is actually the first graduation step on the device & so can't really be regarded as an accurate measurement.

I would be interested in confirmation of the zero reading from other owners of similar (2013-ish) Cali's.

I would be even more interested in hearing about accurate measurements of current from somebody competent with decent equipment!

In the meantime, I am keeping a daily log of the battery state (volts & %) to see how quickly it drops.
So I can't use the Cali or I need to start all over again!

With 140 Ah of leisure batteries and 0.2 Amps draw, you have about 30 days before they are emptied.
The Central Panel current itself is probably just below 0.2 Amps, that is why it displays 0.2A or 0.0A, it is just on the treshold of indication.
The next value would be 0.4A, if caused by the inverter. But perhaps it is not reaching the level, even if there is some additional draw.

The engine battery is separated and not affected.

As far as I know the current draw is measured on the infamous Earth Shunt resistor.
So if you want more accurate measurements, just remove the fridge and measure it on the Earth Shunt with multimeter.

The percentage on the CP is completely unreliable as indication of battery remaining, voltage is more trustful.


Cheers
Andrzej

 

[2CV67]

Up till now, I charged the batteries for 24 hours every month.

If it is really drawing 0.2amps then the batteries would be dead flat before I recharged them.

And the batteries should really never be anywhere near dead flat or they never recover.

I have an idea of 60% being the lowest you should ever go, but maybe somebody can correct me?

All that would mean I can never leave the Cali for more than 10-14 days before fully recharging it.

Let alone the shorter autonomy on-site...

 

[Andresz]

Up till now, I charged the batteries for 24 hours every month.

If it is really drawing 0.2amps then the batteries would be dead flat before I recharged them.

And the batteries should really never be anywhere near dead flat or they never recover.

I have an idea of 60% being the lowest you should ever go, but maybe somebody can correct me?

All that would mean I can never leave the Cali for more than 10-14 days before fully recharging it.

Let alone the shorter autonomy on-site...

If you drive from time to time, then there is no problem. But if you leave the Cali alone for a month or more, you better switch everything, including central panel and inverter, off.

 

[Stu]

Due to it's design an Inverter will consume a small amount of power even without having a a consumer plugged in.

This document helps to explain it in a much better way than I could

http://www.jaycar.co.uk/images_uploaded/inverter.pdf

 

[Andresz]

Due to it's design an Inverter will consume a small amount of power even without having a a consumer plugged in.

This document helps to explain it in a much better way than I could

http://www.jaycar.co.uk/images_uploaded/inverter.pdf

This is general rules for inverters. Not necessary applying for the Cali inverter. With little bit of smart design inverter might be zero consuming when idle.

 

[Stu]

I would still argue there is some consumption and wasted energy from heat etc.

The only way, in my opinion, they could prevent consumption would be to have an isolating on/off switch. So long as the primary remains energised the transformer will be consuming power.