Electric Scooters

[Amarillo]

If you wan't to be pedantic the sign at the Blackwell tunnel doesn't say you can cycle a moped through the tunnel I just says its legal to take a moped through, the manor of propulsion isn't mentioned.

Yes I am being pedantic, and still I disagree. The sign prohibits cycling, not bicycles, except mopeds. A ban on pedestrians pushing bicycles or bicycles carried through by motor vehicle would need a separate sign.

 

[WelshGas]

Could it be cycled with the engine disengaged? My dad used to commute into London on a 25cc moped in the 70s. His bike could be cycled.

No. You could pedal if the engine failed to start but it was quicker to push it. The pedals turned the engine which turned the wheel.

 

[andyinluton]

Yes I am being pedantic, and still I disagree. The sign prohibits cycling, not bicycles, except mopeds. A ban on pedestrians pushing bicycles or bicycles carried through by motor vehicle would need a separate sign.

In this case you are wrong.

You are over complicating things, pedestrians are banned as well - have been since 1969

So if bikes are banned & pedestrians are banned, I don't think somehow a pedestrian pushing a bike would be allowed.

I suppose you are now going to say you can put your bike on a surf board & surf through the tunnel as there isn't a specific sign that says you can't do it.

Newspaper article June 2014.

A cyclist with more wheels than brain-cells closed the Blackwall Tunnel this afternoon after trying to ride through it.

Transport for London said the cyclist's idiotic antics led to the closure of the tunnel southbound.

The tunnel has now reopened, although some residual queues remain on approach.

Although Blackwall Tunnel is only open to motor vehicles but that has not stopped cyclists and even pedestrians trying to use it in the past.

 

[Mickyb123]

Amerill, it would be quite interesting the chat with the copper. you are right the road sign prohibits cycling through the tunnel, apart from very early mopeds the pedals were a way of starting or assisting the engine, the moped on the picture certainly could not be propelled for any distance if the engine had failed, but it was possible. If the engine had failed or no petrol for example cycling to a petrol station was not practically possible. The vehicle is therefore effectively un roadworthy.
Pedantically though I will agree with you, if you were lucky enough to have a classic moped, legally you could probably argue that it could go through the tunnel pedal only, for reasons above I reckon you would still end up with a ticket for using a vehicle that was not in roadworthy condition. Electrically assisted cycles fall under rules for cycles. Electric scooters are still not covered by road signs, because use on roads are illegal apart from certain circumstance.
The fool on the M1 I would suggest had not hired the scooter. Therefore illegal.Using same discussion, bicycles of any sort illegal on M1. Mopeds are also illegal on mway.s why because it’s a quick way to cause a pile up due to speed differential. Blackwall tunnel is a very different road which is why they allow mopeds. You could argue electrical assisted bikes could go faster than a
of vintage mopeds but legally that’s irrelevant.
Legally I can take my 150cc 52 lambretta on the mway! I wouldn’!

Max speed that elec motor assst can drive you to on a bike 15.5 mph. Max speed on a moped 28mph min speeds not stipulated.

Back to Cali tbough, I learnt a lesson last time down round Paris took the van through the tunnel round the west near Versailles, clearance is fine but strewth it looks close, very odd feeling, not taking that route again.

 

[Borris]

I have a theory. Any thread started on this forum will always end up peddling the thorny subject of bicycles.

 

[Amarillo]

In this case you are wrong.

You are over complicating things, pedestrians are banned as well - have been since 1969

So if bikes are banned & pedestrians are banned, I don't think somehow a pedestrian pushing a bike would be allowed.

I suppose you are now going to say you can put your bike on a surf board & surf through the tunnel as there isn't a specific sign that says you can't do it.

You are now inferring something I never said. I know that pedestrians pushing bikes are not permitted, or indeed pedestrians of any type. I was simply saying that the the specific sign I pointed out was "no cycling" not "no bicycles", and that cycling a moped through (for mopeds which can be cycled) would be lawful.

Until relatively recently prohibition signs for the Blackwall Tunnel were notoriously ambiguous. Indeed, it was possible to ride a bike through the tunnel from the Thames Cycle Path without passing a single "no cycling" sign. Happily, that has now been rectified.

 

[andyinluton]

I don't know what I am supposed to have inferred.

In one post you say. "A ban on pedestrians pushing bicycles .....would need a separate sign."

Next post its "I know that pedestrians pushing bikes are not permitted"



Back to the main question:
When what I think you are trying to ask in an extremely obtuse manor, is that if in the unlikely scenario that some one with a moped from the 60s that happened to have pedals, decides as a laugh to hold up all the traffic on a main road by peddling at 2mph instead of using the engine, is it legal.

I think the only possible answer could be, who cares?

 

[Mickyb123]

Us moped riders care (am joking)
Back to the tread though, buying an electric scooter for use at a camp site. Currently would probably just result in annoying quite a number of others on the campsite and incurring the wrath of campsite owner if you haven’t asked permission first. You can’t ride it to shops off site as currently it’s not legal. Can’t see point in buying one just yet.

 

[Nick Stubbs]

Is the 'ped' in moped not a reference to pedal?

Bring back the NSU Quickly!

FS1E....

 

[Mickyb123]

My mate took his ”fizzy” to a scooter rally, Wiltshire to woolacombe absolute hoot. Pedals had been removed. Did hole the piston on the a361 thrashing it though. Oh what fun! Went down a storm with scooter lot. Surfers in campers not happy stuck behind him though.

 

[Joker 1299]

Is the 'ped' in moped not a reference to pedal?

Bring back the NSU Quickly!

NSU Quickly, those things were as fast as f*ck. my mate and I both had mopeds back in the day for messing around on the local fields. Mine was a Norman Nippy, his was was the NSU. We both took the baffles out of the silencer (as you do) and the speed of his left me for dead!

 

[ArunAlec]

https://www.facebook.com/AdurandWorthingPolice/photos/a.1686200161611086/2963014757262947

 

[Mickyb123]

Only one word wrong with that article.
could be seized should read will be seized.
Drive a car with no insurance it gets seized!

 

[Amarillo]

Only one word wrong with that article.
could be seized should read will be seized.
Drive a car with no insurance it gets seized!

They’d save more injury if they strictly enforced 20 and 30 mph speed limits.

 

[Mickyb123]

Amarillo, are you referring to, electric scooters here?

 

[Amarillo]

Amarillo, are you referring to, electric scooters here?

No. I’m referring to the police concerning themselves with 100kg of person and scooter, while completely ignoring 3000kg of person and motor vehicle speeding in residential streets.

Electric scooters should be an excellent and safe way for commuters to avoid the daily lockdown crush on public transport.

 

[Mickyb123]

But electric scooters are currently unless under specified rules illegal. And as far as I spotted this thread is about electric scooters. Benefits negatives of! Maybe the PCSO involved was dealing with the offence discussed, not speeding which is a totally different issue.

Staying on thread, electric scooters and there riders just like a small minority of cyclists do, will cause and all ready do cause problems on the roads and pavements.
Just like cars, get caught riding one without insurance, it should be taken off the road.

 

[Amarillo]

Staying on thread, electric scooters and there riders just like a small minority of cyclists do, will cause and all ready do cause problems on the roads and pavements.
Just like cars, get caught riding one without insurance, it should be taken off the road.

I cannot think of any good reason to treat electric scooters any differently from electric bikes.

 

[andyinluton]

I cannot think of any good reason to treat electric scooters any differently from electric bikes.

They are not treated any different.
Any electric bike that doesn't need the operator to peddling is deemed to be a motorbike & needs taxing & insuring. No pedals on a scooter, therefore its a motorbike.

The legislation needs updating carefully & sensibly. The legal electric bikes for example are not limited to 2 wheels & there are no size limitations, so relax the rules as to what is admissible need to be pretty specific as to what is allowed.

I don't know how strict the current enforcement is with trials of the hire scooters ongoing. It may well be that its only people riding on pavements, obviously going more than 14mph or behaving like a general idiot that are pulled.

My biggest concern is lighting. Unlit ones filtering through traffic at dusk are almost impossible to see.

 

[Karlos]

People need to get over the price of e-bikes.
I know they’re expensive compared to regular bikes, but they pay for themselves within no time.
As a family we have reduced our car dependency massively.
We cycle 80% of our trips now.

When you compare the cost of car ownership, Insurance, depreciation, maintenance and fuel. A couple of ebikes pay for themselves within 12 months.
I know people with new BMWs who will lose £10k just driving it off the forecourt...

Tern bikes are fantastic especially the HSD. In-fact the entire range is brilliant.

Our current setup for Cali usage are the Cube Compact Hybrid Sports. They fit so easily on the tow-bar rack. Range & power is brilliant and the handlebars fold and swivel if required.

These bikes are a total game changer IMO

View attachment 70850

And a Trailgator, brings back happy memories.

 

[Karlos]

They are legal for road use in Bristol and London at the moment under a trial of public hire use. They seem to be comparatively bad value for money in terms of range compared to E Bikes though, and the tiny wheels must be limiting.

They have a E scooter trial in Liverpool as well, they are a bloody nightmare.

So far I've encountered people coming at me on the wrong side of the road, along foot paths, adults carrying children on them, in the dark with dark clothing and tiny low down lights and the latest craze (lets see how many people you can get on one)

I have seen them being used in a considerate manner as well but I don't think I have ever seen anyone wearing a helmet.

 

[Amarillo]

And a Trailgator, brings back happy memories.

We used a Trailgator just once, and then he was off...

I love that look of a new cyclist - “am I really doing this!?”

 

[WelshGas]

I cannot think of any good reason to treat electric scooters any differently from electric bikes.

Thought scooters had a throttle whereas e-bikes were pedal assist.

 

[soulstyledevon]

And a Trailgator, brings back happy memories.

Brilliant aren’t they...
We stick him on the gator when we hit the traffic spots and let him run free on the cycle ways.
I would love him to be able to spend more time off, but the roads aren’t safe enough for a 4year old.

To many impatient fatties clogging up the roads, with no respect for other road users...

 

[Mickyb123]

Amarillo, as another poster stated, electric scooters are self propelling vehicles, electric bikes are assisted. They are different.

Think it’s a bit harsh blaming car drivers for A 4 year old not being safe to cycle on the roads. Strewth! For goodness sake the little person is 4 years old stick to cycle paths for at least a couple of years.