6.1 2 day hire - initially disappointed, but now ordered!

[PhilR]

Hi Phil,

We did the same and hired an Ocean for a long weekend, we were convinced that was what we wanted to buy. However, just the same as you we were disappointed with some of the build quality but also how cramped the ocean felt for the two of us and our two little children. In the end we decided we still wanted a Cali but opted for a beach at nearly half the price. There are a number of things which I feel could be better: difficult to turn driver's seat, a side door that opens on the traffic side of the van...not great for little children, a spare wheel primed for theft, etc. But in the 9 months we’ve had the van its proved invaluable...windsurfing van, tip runs, camping weekends (with awning), mobile office during Covid, taking all our kit and grandad to a holiday cottage in comfort, transporting a bunk bed, and so on.

From what you say in your initial post it sounds like an ocean maybe an expensive purchase that provides a lot of functionality you won't get full use of. When we initially looked at the Californias we wondered why anyone would buy a beach, I can happily say my view has 100% reversed. The only issue is that they are no longer available brand new in the UK so you'd have to buy in Ireland or mainland Europe, alternatively you could get a nearly new at home and save even more money.

I'm sorry about some of the less charming responses on the forum...maybe they're trying to justify their £70k purchase...each to their own.

Good luck with your search

Hi Hayde, that’s nice of you to say, thanks. To be fair I was always going to upset one or two which I don’t like doing, but I can understand them getting annoyed as they love their Cali’s and the whole lifestyle. I desperately want to be part of it but I can’t deny I was a little disappointed initially. Having slept on it and hours of discussions with my wife, I’m still wanting to go for it in one form or another. She is not as convinced as I am but she knows it’s been my dream for a while. I actually wanted to get a little boat to use in Wales as I love the idea of sailing out into the bay, and having a nice brew and just chilling out, but it’s far too much hassle and cost. With a Cali I could have a similar experience but just on land!! So maybe we don’t have to think about it for holidays or overnight trips too much, but more of a great days out van, most of the time??

 

[Eber123]

Good evening,

I don't know what started my interest in the California, but 2x years before we bought one I was watching every Youtube Video and read every articel I could find about the VW Camper.

At the time I had the VW Tiguan and my wife had the VW Polo. The Polo was due for service. The plan was that we drive from work to VW to collect the Polo. At lunch time I got a phone call from my wife asking if I could leave work even a bit ealier.

What I didn't know was that my wife arranged an appointment to look at a demo VW California Ocean. She saw the adertisement on the dealers web page. At this time I wasn't aware of this.

So you can imagine my suprise as we arraived at the VW dealer and looked and the camper. We spend almost 3x hours there (inlculding a test drive). The specification was almost ok. What the van didn't have was the DSG, which was importent to me.

Still in the VW dealer show room over a coffee we discussed this. I told her that I wouldn't be happy with a Camper without DSG. But what she said was, we need to do a realtiy check. Even a California demo model incl. DSG would have been several thousend Euros more epxensive - so expensive that we could not afford it. The decision had to be made to take this or have no California at all.

At this evening we signed the contract and bought the VW California Ocean. We never had a camper van or motohome before. In 30 years of marriage we even didn't go camping. Now, after almost 3x years I am happy that we have the California. I even got almost used to the manual transmission.

As you mentioned I would love to have a fully spec T6.1, big engine, DSG and also very important to me 4motion and differential lock. I spoke to the dealer in March. In Ireland I wold have to pay for such a vehickle around EUR 95.000! Trade in for mine EUR 45.000. I had to find EUR 50.000 somewhere. Not even a kittney is that expensive. Again reality check, I love and keep my Ocean and try to get the best out of it. I believe that 90% and more of us never use the vehicle to its fullest potential. So this gives me a lot to do before I am to old to drive.

What I am trying to say is dreams are wonderful if they can be financed, but reality will eventually catch up with us all. Think what you wish to do with a recreational vehicle and try to get one that fits the wish list and is affordable. These are exiting times for you and your family - good luck.

Happy Californa,
Eberhard

 

[BeagleMum]

Hi Hayde, that’s nice of you to say, thanks. To be fair I was always going to upset one or two which I don’t like doing, but I can understand them getting annoyed as they love their Cali’s and the whole lifestyle. I desperately want to be part of it but I can’t deny I was a little disappointed initially. Having slept on it and hours of discussions with my wife, I’m still wanting to go for it in one form or another. She is not as convinced as I am but she knows it’s been my dream for a while. I actually wanted to get a little boat to use in Wales as I love the idea of sailing out into the bay, and having a nice brew and just chilling out, but it’s far too much hassle and cost. With a Cali I could have a similar experience but just on land!! So maybe we don’t have to think about it for holidays or overnight trips too much, but more of a great days out van, most of the time??

We've always had camping stoves and bits of camping equipment in the back of our cars, namely Rav4’s then four years ago we changed to a 7 seater Toyota Landcruiser which gave us more room. It was a beautiful vehicle in every way, build, comfort, versatility, but ever since I can remember I’d wanted a Campervan but couldn’t afford one. Eighteen months ago we bought a VW Beach with the 2 seat bench. We chose the Beach as we wanted the extra space, we didn’t want permanent fixtures such as a wardrobe or a tiny sink.
Before we bought a California we looked at other options, makes, conversions, there are some lovely vans out there. The most important thing is you need to be clear in your own mind about how you want to use a Campervan. We mix it up, we often have a week in the van followed by a week in a cottage then another few days in the van.
Just because you have a Campervan doesn’t mean you can’t stay in a hotel, cottage, go on a cruise. We also get huge enjoyment and a lot of use from our Beach using it for day trips, it gives you options you don’t have with a car. I guess we are unusual as we never hired a van before we bought, a test drive was sufficient for us as we knew it was the lifestyle we wanted. Don’t let the poor experience you’ve had be the end of your adventures, hire some different vehicles, do different things with the van when you do and then if you decide it’s not for you, you’ll know you’ve made an informed decision and not a knee jerk reaction to one bad experience. Good luck whatever you decide.

 

[Kernowboy]

Yes I get your confusion - originally we were looking at a fully loaded Ocean, 199 + 4MO, so roughly £70k with discount. Obviously more of a compromise going for a Coast, but that’s the whole point of considering that option, as it is then a big difference in cost but not in actual usability and enjoyment. It could be that option or forgetting it altogether, or maybe going down the conversion route but as much as I found a few faults with the 6.1, I still think it looks a better buy if we go for the Coast. I would feel a bit happier with any niggles at £53k rather than £70k. Hope that all makes sense?!!!

Doesn't make sense to me. Agree with Calimili here - I specced a loaded 199 4MO and it came out at 64k OTR with discount; all the options you could ever want. Not sure how you get to 70k but you're not comparing like for like.

 

[Wogga]

My final tuppence worth and I do feel your pain. I looked and looked at what was out there. What tipped me to VW was:
a. The "rock and roll" bed, in most conversions it is fixed, so on a wet evening MrsW is having tea sat at the back of the van 4ft away with her little table and I am sat in the Pax seat with a second table, generally the drivers chair doesn't turn.
b. I have left the butter in the fridge, move my table, down on my hands and knees and root in the low level fridge for it.
c. It's getting cold, put a jumper on because the vans doesn't have a heater. I was too tight to spec the £1500 heater.
d. The evening warms up so I get the nicely stored chairs and tables out and sit under the awning watching the world go by.

I could go on the limitations on conversions layout, they are all the same. Usually built on a base van and when you go like for like to meet a cali spec you are in California price terroritity. Now currently get 4 years warranty and breakdown cover and some free services at a VW dealer........ Yes I pulled the trigger and ordered the California.

 

[PhilR]

Doesn't make sense to me. Agree with Calimili here - I specced a loaded 199 4MO and it came out at 64k OTR with discount; all the options you could ever want. Not sure how you get to 70k but you're not comparing like for like.

No I’m definitely not comparing like for like, I know that.....I’ll try and explain my thought process....so originally I specced a 199 4MO with a lot of stuff as my thought process then was if we were going to spend this kind of money we should go for it and get exactly what we want. We get to enjoy the high spec and it’s good for resale time. So with two tone paint, diff lock, DCC, chrome pack, Discover Pro, velour seats, bed mattress, shower and a few other little bits the RRP was £79k.
After our experience we are now being more realistic in our expectations, plus I’m trying to convince my wife and myself that it’s still a good idea to get a Cali, so the Coast with a lot less of the options on but still doing most of the things we want it to do is around £53k. Does that make any sense now? I’m still not saying that’s what we’ll do, but it’s certainly something to consider.

 

[subthree]

No I’m definitely not comparing like for like, I know that.....I’ll try and explain my thought process....so originally I specced a 199 4MO with a lot of stuff as my thought process then was if we were going to spend this kind of money we should go for it and get exactly what we want. We get to enjoy the high spec and it’s good for resale time. So with two tone paint, diff lock, DCC, chrome pack, Discover Pro, velour seats, bed mattress, shower and a few other little bits the RRP was £79k.
After our experience we are now being more realistic in our expectations, plus I’m trying to convince my wife and myself that it’s still a good idea to get a Cali, so the Coast with a lot less of the options on but still doing most of the things we want it to do is around £53k. Does that make any sense now? I’m still not saying that’s what we’ll do, but it’s certainly something to consider.

If you are thinking there is a good chance this might not work out for you then you probably want to think about optional extras will help resale. Front and rear parking sensors, reversing camera and LED headlights would be must haves for me. That's £2k extra on a Coast. Auxiliary heater another £1k. Lights in the pop top roof £700. Personally I would go with an Ocean. A tsunami of other opinions will no doubt follow!

 

[Calimili]

What extras did you spec on the coast to get to 53k ?
Last year i bought mine and went through the same process. I was configuring a Coast , I knew I def wanted 150PS dsg 4M, regardless. On the coast i add to add some extras I needed, like the front opening on the tent , double glazing, alloy wheels, fog lights, moskito net for the sliding window above the sink, the interior lights package, heated pipes for the screen wipers, and the 3 zone climate A/C, diesel heater, and heated seats. The biggest ticket items being related to climate control, like double glazed windows, 3 zone A/C (not so much for differentiating temp front to back, but it includes a second a/c unit for the rear, given the inside volume of a van, the front only a/c wouldn’t be able to cope in summer), and the diesel heater.
6860eur of extras for the coast, which were included in the ocean which still cost 1300 eur on top. But for those 1300 I got the electric roof, soft close of the sliding door, some extra usb sockets, and some extra esthetic features like painted rear view mirrors etc. So for 1300eur more it just made sense.
Also to consider how extras are generally valued in the second hand market.

 

[subthree]

I also think you need to think about depreciation differently and hence how much you are "investing" - this is how we approached it. If you buy a car, even a premium one, you will lose two thirds 3 years later.

My brother in law bought a 3 year old T5 4 years ago i.e. now 7 years old. He paid £32k. He would sell it for the same now. That is crazy!

We came to the conclusion better to invest our £55-60k in the Cali than 1% interest in the bank. If we don't like we can sell it and lose next to nothing, even in a couple of years. If we lose £5k so what, cost more to rent one for a few weeks.

 

[2into1]

Autumn is nearly here. Expect a lot more new owners to be having the same realisations and selling their rush-bought Cali’s. Harsh ride, poor handling, rattles, not enough space, awful in awful weather. The only difference here is @PhilR was smart enough to rent first.
It’s not that Cali’s aren’t the best campervans out there, just that campervanning isn’t for everyone and certainly isn’t always the dreamy coastal plot / sipping wine / under fairy lights / watching the sunset experience envisaged during those sunny lockdown days.

 

[Wogga]

I kept looking at this Phil, private sale I don't think I could raise the finance for it? never enquired but went for PCP from the dealer on a new Ocean.


2019(69) VW California Ocean, 2.0 150 TDI, DSG 150miles

Good luck whatever your choice, it was a good thread and I will keep following.

 

[2into1]

I kept looking at this Phil, private sale I don't think I could raise the finance for it? never enquired but went for PCP from the dealer on a new Ocean.


2019(69) VW California Ocean, 2.0 150 TDI, DSG 150miles

Good luck whatever your choice, it was a good thread and I will keep following.

That’s been on here forever. It’s a good example of the market changes. It was too expensive when it went on and is now too cheap! (Asking price hasn’t changed). I suspect it might be sold by now ?

 

[Wildcamper]

Autumn is nearly here. Expect a lot more new owners to be having the same realisations and selling their rush-bought Cali’s. Harsh ride, poor handling, rattles, not enough space, awful in awful weather. The only difference here is @PhilR was smart enough to rent first.
It’s not that Cali’s aren’t the best campervans out there, just that campervanning isn’t for everyone and certainly isn’t always the dreamy coastal plot / sipping wine / under fairy lights / watching the sunset experience envisaged during those sunny lockdown days.

Some interesting comments that reflect on why we went non-California but the conversion route. See earlier post.

Harsh ride - I assume our Highline T6 has about the same ride as a T6 Cali. Personally I do not find our ride hard. Each to their own.
Poor Handling - again probably no difference between ours and the Cali. I do not find our T6 handles poorly. Again each to their own.
Rattles - not an issue.
Awful in Awful weather. Our high top LWB t6 is great. As fully insulated is warm inside when cold outside. Fine in the rain. Can rock in high winds but park inline with the wind and no issue. No need to lower the top and no flapping of fabric. Can stand up and move about inside in all weathers as no need to lower the top.
Not enough space - we have loads and are not yet to get close to filling it.
It all come down to personal preference. No one is right and no one is wrong. It's just "what works for each individual".

 

[Calimili]

Awful in Awful weather. Our high top LWB t6 is great. As fully insulated is warm inside when cold outside. Fine in the rain. Can rock in high winds but park inline with the wind and no issue. No need to lower the top and no flapping of fabric. Can stand up and move about inside in all weathers as no need to lower the top.

100% with you. Your fixed high top and LWB is from a camping point of view always superior. It removes a lot of faffing around, the duvet/sleeping bags with pillows always there, no worries whatever the weather.
But the whole point of a California is its compact size, 5m long and 2m high to fit in a normal car parking. Less aerodynamic resistance at high speed and lateral wind. It can be parked on a street and looks like any other plumber van, gets unnoticed. It can be used as a first or second car.
It is a totally different vehicle from any high top.
If somebody doesn't need all of the above, then certainly a fixed top. But then I would probably go for Ducato/Sprinter/Crafter based vehicle, the biggest I can get.

 

[Jabberwocky]

Too many decisions made with the head can lead to a dull/predictable life. Yes, I could have spent the money on a sports car or a better riding luxury limo but you don't get the life with those choices. I've had my Cali for just over three years now. No regrets, even with all those idiosyncrasies. Have visited 9 different countries outside the UK and each time we have a sense of freedom as soon as we set out from home. I can put up with a few little gremlins for that. So far nothing too serious has gone wrong thankfully. The furthest and longest we have been away? Norway - 6 weeks, Italy - 4 weeks (no back problems). Even managed two long weekends away during lockdown.
I am so glad I listened to my heart!!
Mind you it helps that we are both retired and can still get up to the upper bed.

 

[Nomis]

The last 15 months I have lived 12 months in the Cali and 3 months in my house.

A Cali grows on you. It might take a few months but it does grow on you. A weekend hire will not give you that feeling.

Time to sell my house...

 

[Borris]

So Phil you said:
"So, we could get an older one or a conversion, but we're also thinking of not bothering at all and hiring one when we want to do a trip. The main use of the vehicle would be going back and forth to Wales from the Midlands, as we have a place there. So 90% of the usage would be doing that. Yes it would be fabulous for days out and the odd overnight stay, but that's not going to be a common thing. We also fancy touring Europe for a couple of weeks each year, but for that I'd be tempted to hire a full size motorhome maybe."

If you are still interested in a campervan then I would take a long hard look at the facilities such a vehicle would provide but more importantly how and when you would use them? As I previously mentioned we are now on our third Cali (an end of line fully loaded T5-1 SE 180 dsg 4motion with diff lock etc etc and two seven seater Beaches). The SE was an ex demo vehicle that the dealer had thrown every option at. In the time we owned that splendid vehicle we never used the sink (too small), never filled the water tank or used the tap, and rarely cooked in it. Not once did we either use or need the 4motion or diff lock (something I would never have specced if it had been a factory order). We found the internal lay out to be wonderful design if not rather difficult to use if you are cooking inside during inclement weather. For a full fat Cali Ocean to work well you really need to banish all other passengers and get every thing out before you start cooking. If you don't you will be forever getting in and out to get at things in the under seat and under sink cupboards. Many Oceans end up in the "Cali's For Sale" section with the statement "never been cooked in" or worse still, "never been slept in".

From your statement above I would suggest that a second hand T6 Beach might suit you better. These vehicles are no longer made for the UK market and because they have a strong following they are now highly sought after. Accordingly, prices are very firm indeed and are likely to remain so. There is nothing that you can't do in a Beach that you could in an Ocean. The main differences are that they are much less complicated and provide much more usuable internal space. They have a king size downstairs bed and the same sized bed as the Ocean on the upper deck. The roof is manually opened and is simplicity itself, so makes for a much better long term ownership prospect. See the many posts relating to faults with the electro/hydraulic roof and latterly, faults on the T6-1 roof system. You do not have fixed fittings to hamper multi purpose use so what you get is a highly flexible vehicle. Depending on the version you can also seat from four up to seven adults and can use the vehicle as a very capacious load lugger if required.

Should you chose to look at the Beach the only problem you would have is finding one that would meet your preferred spec. High specced Beaches are very rare and are snapped up immediately especially if they have the desired parking heater option.

The reason I mention all this is that buying a campervan is like starting off on a voyage of discovery. Your initial findings haven't been all positive but they have at least been realistic. My advise would be to persevere as there is a lot more to the campervan life than can be discovered from a very short hire. Most people do find that their vans, whether they be a California, a conversion or even a home made project, do enhance their lives considerably. However you do need to ask yourself how you will use the vehicle and therefore what you will need it to do for you. If you aren't likely to use it then don't spec it.

What ever you decide, good luck.

 

[2into1]

Our high top LWB t6 is great

Been there, done it (see bio). Bigger, higher, hard top all make for better British camping, but as my user name suggests, the pop top swb is the best compromise 2nd (in my case ONLY) car for most.
Once you are beyond something that fits INSIDE a Tesco parking space and under a 2m barrier, it's a whole different debate as to where is the next sweet spot. Glad you've found yours.

 

[Calimili]

So Phil you said:
"So, we could get an older one or a conversion, but we're also thinking of not bothering at all and hiring one when we want to do a trip. The main use of the vehicle would be going back and forth to Wales from the Midlands, as we have a place there. So 90% of the usage would be doing that. Yes it would be fabulous for days out and the odd overnight stay, but that's not going to be a common thing. We also fancy touring Europe for a couple of weeks each year, but for that I'd be tempted to hire a full size motorhome maybe."

If you are still interested in a campervan then I would take a long hard look at the facilities such a vehicle would provide but more importantly how and when you would use them? As I previously mentioned we are now on our third Cali (an end of line fully loaded T5-1 SE 180 dsg 4motion with diff lock etc etc and two seven seater Beaches). The SE was an ex demo vehicle that the dealer had thrown every option at. In the time we owned that splendid vehicle we never used the sink (too small), never filled the water tank or used the tap, and rarely cooked in it. Not once did we either use or need the 4motion or diff locks (something I would never have specced if it had been a factory order). We found the internal lay out to be wonderful design if not rather difficult to use if you are cooking inside during inclement weather. For a full fat Cali Ocean to work well you really need to banish all other passengers and get every thing out before you start cooking. If you don't you will be forever getting in and out to get at things in the under seat and under sink cupboards. Many Oceans end up in the "Cali's For Sale" section with the statement "never been cooked in" or worse still, "never been slept in".

From your statement above I would suggest that a second hand T6 Beach might suit you better. These vehicles are no longer made for the UK market and because they have a strong following they are now highly sought after. Accordingly, prices are very firm indeed and are likely to remain so. There is nothing that you can't do in a Beach that you could in an Ocean. The main differences are that they are much less complicated and provide much more usuable internal space. They have a king size downstairs bed and the same sized bed as the Ocean on the upper deck. The roof is manually opened and is simplicity itself, so makes for a much better long term ownership prospect. See the many posts relating to faults with the electro/hydraulic roof and latterly, faults on the T6-1 roof system. You do not have fixed fittings to hamper multi purpose use so what you get is a highly flexible vehicle. Depending on the version you can also seat from four up to seven adults and can use the vehicle as a very capacious load lugger if required.

Should you chose to look at the Beach the only problem you would have is finding one that would meet your preferred spec. High specced Beaches are very rare and are snapped up immediately especially if they have the desired parking heater option.

The reason I mention all this is that buying a campervan is like starting off on a voyage of discovery. Your initial findings haven't been all positive but they have at least been realistic. My advise would be to persevere as there is a lot more to the campervan life than can be discovered from a very short hire. Most people do find that their vans, whether they be a California, a conversion or even a home made project, do enhance their lives considerably. However you do need to ask yourself how you will use the vehicle and therefore what you will need it to do for you. If you aren't likely to use it then don't spec it.

What ever you decide, good luck.

Borris, this thread is a concealed Ocean vs Coast fight, what are you doing throwing in the Beach as well?
On a serious note, I must disagree that many Oceans end up for sales after the first seasons, or it may be many , but the great majority stay with their owners because many of us do use the the sink regularly to wash face/hands, brushing teeth and washing small items, like a breakfast bowl or a mug or two. The high second hand prices confirm there is more demand than offer...
I do agree the sink is small for a proper washing up, but you certainly are not better off in a Beach. I find the cupboard and wardrobe very usable, I had to eat inside on many occasions and surely you need a bit of patience, but if I need milk I access it it easily from the inbuilt fridge, rather than having to go outside in pouring rain to open the tailgate, slide the drawer open, open the fridge , get the milk, close fridge, slide the draw back in close the tailgate, get wet again and get into the the van soaked. God forbid you forgot the butter too!
For cooking outside Beach , Ocean and any car would do, as you rely on an external stove.
The issue with the electric roof were on old models, I could counter how easier it is with an electric roof not to get the roof tent stuck outside or into the mechanism when closing.
If I do a 2-3 days trip, I fill water at home , and it will last for the entire trip. To empty the water, on the way back, I stop at the camping water facility and discharge the grey water turning a lever from inside the van (again no rain for me), instead of ferrying heavy water cans with fresh water first, and dirty water after...
It all depends how you camp. Maybe you don't need water at all as you use the site facilities all the times, you cook always outside or go to the restaurant then yes, why would you need an Ocean as the Beach is sufficient and would provide other valuable advantages as you mention, as a people carrier or transporter. Once again to each their own.
You point of really thinking HOW you are going to use it , I couldn't agree more.

 

[Borris]

Borris, this thread is a concealed Ocean vs Coast fight, what are you doing throwing in the Beach as well?
On a serious note, I must disagree that many Oceans end up for sales after the first seasons, or it may be many , but the great majority stay with their owners because many of us do use the the sink regularly to wash face/hands, brushing teeth and washing small items, like a breakfast bowl or a mug or two. The high second hand prices confirm there is more demand than offer...
I do agree the sink is small for a proper washing up, but you certainly are not better off in a Beach. I find the cupboard and wardrobe very usable, I had to eat inside on many occasions and surely you need a bit of patience, but if I need milk I access it it easily from the inbuilt fridge, rather than having to go outside in pouring rain to open the tailgate, slide the drawer open, open the fridge , get the milk, close fridge, slide the draw back in close the tailgate, get wet again and get into the the van soaked. God forbid you forgot the butter too!
For cooking outside Beach , Ocean and any car would do, as you rely on an external stove.
The issue with the electric roof were on old models, I could counter how easier it is with an electric roof not to get the roof tent stuck outside or into the mechanism when closing.
If I do a 2-3 days trip, I fill water at home , and it will last for the entire trip. To empty the water, on the way back, I stop at the camping water facility and discharge the grey water turning a lever from inside the van (again no rain for me), instead of ferrying heavy water cans with fresh water first, and dirty water after...
It all depends how you camp. Maybe you don't need water at all as you use the site facilities all the times, you cook always outside or go to the restaurant then yes, why would you need an Ocean as the Beach is sufficient and would provide other valuable advantages as you mention, as a people carrier or transporter. Once again to each their own.
You point of really thinking HOW you are going to use it , I couldn't agree more.

The point of my post was not to promote one model over another but to advise Phil that there might be another more suitable solution to his dilemma. His initial post suggested that 90% of the vehicle's use would be for going between the Midlands and Wales and that it would only occasionally be required to perforn camping duties. Under such circumstances I feel that encouraging someone to spend £70k on a vehicle that is designed almost exclusively to perform one roll, that of an all out camper van, would be wrong. My including my thoughts on the diferences between the various California models were merely included to illustrate the point.

As much as I like the California in all of it's forms I wouldn't want to encourage anyone to commit to spending what is a King's ransom on something that might prove to be wholly inappropriate to their needs. I believe there is more than adequate evidence that quite a few owners march into their nearest Cali showroom to buy into the campervan dream without having given their future needs and the use of their chosen vehicle much thought.

My post was intended to help ensure Phil didn't make the same mistake.

 

[Elmo3]

The bonus kitchen pod that came in our Beach is actually better than that in the Ocean. Much more practical and durable, with a sink that’s a useable size and 2 decent hobs which don’t melt the washing up bowl. Water, waste and gas storage underneath so you can get to everything easily and don’t have to dismantle the van to fix a problem.

 

[Vagophile]

As @2into1 says, it's horses for courses.
My wife and I have enjoyed 15 years of motor home travelling in retirement spending 3 months at a time exploring the delights of Europe.
Fixed bed, hot water, 135 litre fridge/freezer, oven, grill, 3 burner hob, unrivalled shower and toilet, lots of storage capacity... We would park (either on site or not) and use our trusty motorbike to get around, so the size of our motor home wasn't a problem. We never holidayed in the U.K. and only used our motor home in the U.K. to visit relatives. The main consideration was the "domestic" side of the vehicle, although we chose a 156 H.P. Sprinter to do the job.
Now things have changed. Time has passed and my wife's health is not so good. The days of long holidays abroad have gone.
What we need now is a smaller vehicle, easy to park in normal spaces but still with the capability for weekends away, or even longer if possible. Something that we can park at home and use at the drop of a hat.
Having owned a Kombi of 1970 vintage in the past, my thinking was a VW camper of some description.
Price was not an issue, but I would be just as happy to buy something for £30,000 as £70,000, being of the old school who prefer to hold onto their brass if possible. So realistically, it was used and it soon became clear that a California seemed to be a better value for money bet than a conversion. The choice then just fell to age, engine size and spec. As far as specification is concerned, my present car is the first to have had air conditioning, so virtually anything extra would give a level of sophistication new to me.
There were plenty of vehicles on offer and I chose to buy from a local dealer. The only item on my "must have" list was a tow bar. I know now that I didn't fully research the market, assuming that current offers are merely an extension of what was available when I had my Kombi.
In the event, I have acquired a decent vehicle at a competitive price, but I wouldn't be too worried if that were not the case. Life's too short and the only looser is likely to be the Cat's Protection League.

 

[PhilR]

So Phil you said:
"So, we could get an older one or a conversion, but we're also thinking of not bothering at all and hiring one when we want to do a trip. The main use of the vehicle would be going back and forth to Wales from the Midlands, as we have a place there. So 90% of the usage would be doing that. Yes it would be fabulous for days out and the odd overnight stay, but that's not going to be a common thing. We also fancy touring Europe for a couple of weeks each year, but for that I'd be tempted to hire a full size motorhome maybe."

If you are still interested in a campervan then I would take a long hard look at the facilities such a vehicle would provide but more importantly how and when you would use them? As I previously mentioned we are now on our third Cali (an end of line fully loaded T5-1 SE 180 dsg 4motion with diff lock etc etc and two seven seater Beaches). The SE was an ex demo vehicle that the dealer had thrown every option at. In the time we owned that splendid vehicle we never used the sink (too small), never filled the water tank or used the tap, and rarely cooked in it. Not once did we either use or need the 4motion or diff lock (something I would never have specced if it had been a factory order). We found the internal lay out to be wonderful design if not rather difficult to use if you are cooking inside during inclement weather. For a full fat Cali Ocean to work well you really need to banish all other passengers and get every thing out before you start cooking. If you don't you will be forever getting in and out to get at things in the under seat and under sink cupboards. Many Oceans end up in the "Cali's For Sale" section with the statement "never been cooked in" or worse still, "never been slept in".

From your statement above I would suggest that a second hand T6 Beach might suit you better. These vehicles are no longer made for the UK market and because they have a strong following they are now highly sought after. Accordingly, prices are very firm indeed and are likely to remain so. There is nothing that you can't do in a Beach that you could in an Ocean. The main differences are that they are much less complicated and provide much more usuable internal space. They have a king size downstairs bed and the same sized bed as the Ocean on the upper deck. The roof is manually opened and is simplicity itself, so makes for a much better long term ownership prospect. See the many posts relating to faults with the electro/hydraulic roof and latterly, faults on the T6-1 roof system. You do not have fixed fittings to hamper multi purpose use so what you get is a highly flexible vehicle. Depending on the version you can also seat from four up to seven adults and can use the vehicle as a very capacious load lugger if required.

Should you chose to look at the Beach the only problem you would have is finding one that would meet your preferred spec. High specced Beaches are very rare and are snapped up immediately especially if they have the desired parking heater option.

The reason I mention all this is that buying a campervan is like starting off on a voyage of discovery. Your initial findings haven't been all positive but they have at least been realistic. My advise would be to persevere as there is a lot more to the campervan life than can be discovered from a very short hire. Most people do find that their vans, whether they be a California, a conversion or even a home made project, do enhance their lives considerably. However you do need to ask yourself how you will use the vehicle and therefore what you will need it to do for you. If you aren't likely to use it then don't spec it.

What ever you decide, good luck.

Thanks Borris, really appreciate your thoughtful response. We talked about the Beach but even if we didn’t use the van much, the convenience of stopping wherever and whenever and making a brew sways us towards the Ocean or Coast. Yes this can be done in a Beach but not as spontaneously.
We’ve just popped along to Weston Park today and there is a campervan festival going on. We had a great time walking around the site looking at loads of different vans and awnings, etc. It was good to see how they are actually used like that. We spoke to some owners too. I think we’ve still got the bug, it’s an exciting prospect for sure.
Thanks once again to all the posts on here. You have all been a tremendous help to us
I’m going to contact the place we hired from to see if they have a Coast for hire. If not I’m going to book the Ocean again, I think they have a 150 so I’ll try and get that next time.

 

[Borris]

Thanks Borris, really appreciate your thoughtful response. We talked about the Beach but even if we didn’t use the van much, the convenience of stopping wherever and whenever and making a brew sways us towards the Ocean or Coast. Yes this can be done in a Beach but not as spontaneously.
We’ve just popped along to Weston Park today and there is a campervan festival going on. We had a great time walking around the site looking at loads of different vans and awnings, etc. It was good to see how they are actually used like that. We spoke to some owners too. I think we’ve still got the bug, it’s an exciting prospect for sure.
Thanks once again to all the posts on here. You have all been a tremendous help to us
I’m going to contact the place we hired from to see if they have a Coast for hire. If not I’m going to book the Ocean again, I think they have a 150 so I’ll try and get that next time.

What ever you decide I hope it suits.

On a separate note, it always amuses me when the "making a brew" issue is raised. I suppose in these days of fast food and drink every second counts. Just get yourself a 1.5 litre stainless steel jug thermos flask and it could save you tens of thousands of pounds. It's all we've ever used in all of our vans. Within seconds of pulling the handbrake on you are sipping your hot brew and you don't even have to get in the back either.

 

[Karlos]

Hi phil

I recently sold our Ocean which we bought new late last year. I have also had a conversion on a LWB Hiline which I commissioned and the Ocean is head and shoulders above the conversion in terms of how light and airy it felt.

My heart misses the Cali every day but my head tells me I have done the right thing, if I was to buy another Cali and was thinking about long term ownership I would consider a Coast but on bigger wheels. We have just had a week in Scotland in our folding camper towed by my wife's Audi Convertible, we both commented on much we had enjoyed having the car to go exploring and I think this is the way we will go camping for sometime to come.

Borris is right about the Beech but I can't help wondering if you would be spending a small fortune on a vehicle that you would use mainly for commuting back and forth to Wales presumably to a holiday home. When we are touring in the car I have an electric cool box in the back seat with table, chairs and a small gas stove in the boot to make a brew and food if required but does require good weather.

The Cali in all its guises is a fantastic vehicle although with some faults for some people, I had no issues with mine and found it to be very comfortable. I hope whatever you decide is the correct decision for you and wish you the best of luck.