Safety of members is the duty of any forum

[tobyprivett]

Aires are useful if you arrive late at night and haven’t booked anywhere to stay. Also, there are aires near attractions so can be good for an easy night.

 

[GrumpyGranddad]

Google the Paradox of Tolerance, it’s interesting and maybe applies to some posts in this thread?

The paradox of tolerance arises when a tolerant person holds antagonistic views towards intolerance, and hence is intolerant of it. The tolerant individual would then be by definition intolerant of intolerance.

 

[tobyprivett]

Certainly a paradox going on here. Two sides that will never agree to meet in the middle. Not online, at least. Perhaps if they met in real life, one might say ‘I didn’t really mean all that stuff’. Or not.

 

[Californication69]

I think if we met in real life, I’d have my views, and would only discuss them if I had known you for over a few years in real life and you get to know if that person is on the same page as you.
If they are not on the same page, then you don’t mingle, or find ways to discuss things with them.
Thus only surrounding yourselves with like minded people. I mix with many many different walks of life. Takes me 1 minute to know exactly what they are like.
And then I can choose whether I want to listen to them or not. I am open minded to listen to other peoples ideas, etc.
but I keep my mouth shut, and don’t relay what my brain is thinking, if I don’t agree.
Just thought that was how it’s supposed to be in a free world….

 

[chockswahay]

What I don’t understand is that someone will spend upwards of £80k on a campervan but still don’t want to spend €20 a night at this time of year on a fully serviced pitch with fantastic facilities and lots with a beautiful swimming pool.
We stay on one Aire in Cabarceno Spain which has absolutely no facilities but is right next to a wildlife park with some incredible views. We have stayed here for the past 8 years and feel 100% safe.
on our 3 weeks away we spend less than €450 on campsites which is nothing today.
For those of you that mainly stay on Aires with absolutely no facilities you must be glad to get home and use a toilet and have a shower.

That’s an easy one to answer……. Aires are well suited to touring without time agenda. We love to tour in our van and stop where and WHEN we want without having to book in or vacate by a certain time. Aires are often right in the heart of a village or town with easy access to local attractions. We like to road trip in our van and often do so for up to 2 months at a time. If you prefer to sit still on one place then campsites are great….. but not for us. As to keeping clean that is easy!

 

[wildslammer22]

Google the Paradox of Tolerance, it’s interesting and maybe applies to some posts in this thread?

The paradox of tolerance arises when a tolerant person holds antagonistic views towards intolerance, and hence is intolerant of it. The tolerant individual would then be by definition intolerant of intolerance.

I am certainly guilty of that at times. Much of the media and sadly many of our politicians encourage intolerance and division, more and more we are encouraged to define ourselves by what divides us rather than celebrate what unites us. On this forum we are united as all/mostly Cali owners and I do genuinely believe that the OP was just trying to help the community by way of a warning due his own unpleasant experience. That is community minded and to be celebrated.

Language is important, in that anything which dehumanises people can and does have consequences even if they are invisible to those that use that language at the time. Again the OP didn’t do that but others did by using racial stereotypes in response to the original post.

So what to do, stay quiet, live and let live or challenge and become the paradox? To misquote Burke, bad things can happen when good people do nothing.

This thread despite strong and contrary feelings has been mostly good natured, with only a couple throwing around insults. if it has caused any of us to pause and reconsider the language we use when we interact it’s been worthwhile. I for one shall try to be more respectful of people I disagree with.


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[GrumpyGranddad]

I think if we met in real life, I’d have my views, and would only discuss them if I had known you for over a few years in real life and you get to know if that person is on the same page as you.
If they are not on the same page, then you don’t mingle, or find ways to discuss things with them.
Thus only surrounding yourselves with like minded people. I mix with many many different walks of life. Takes me 1 minute to know exactly what they are like.
And then I can choose whether I want to listen to them or not. I am open minded to listen to other peoples ideas, etc.
but I keep my mouth shut, and don’t relay what my brain is thinking, if I don’t agree.
Just thought that was how it’s supposed to be in a free world….

My view is that there is nothing wrong with a healthy debate between people of opposing views as long as each party respects the other. I think it is undesirable to live in an echo chamber where everybody has the same views and opinions. Having said that, I guess we all do it to a certain extent. Maybe it’s how we choose our closest friends.

 

[Corradobrit]

Back to the original post. We are travelling through France right now and it was very useful. Made us decide to stick to campsites.

Also traveling around France. No issues at all finding safe Aires and small allocated parking areas. I do feel more comfortable and sleep sounder if there is at least one other Campervan or Great White nearby. The campsites are used as a last resort and generally just to get a shower and charge up the batteries.

 

[Corradobrit]

What I don’t understand is that someone will spend upwards of £80k on a campervan but still don’t want to spend €20 a night at this time of year on a fully serviced pitch with fantastic facilities and lots with a beautiful swimming pool.
We stay on one Aire in Cabarceno Spain which has absolutely no facilities but is right next to a wildlife park with some incredible views. We have stayed here for the past 8 years and feel 100% safe.
on our 3 weeks away we spend less than €450 on campsites which is nothing today.
For those of you that mainly stay on Aires with absolutely no facilities you must be glad to get home and use a toilet and have a shower.

Horses for courses. I like the freedom a campervan offers for getting off the beaten track and finding beautiful aires or allocated parking right next to rivers, canals etc. Nothing wrong with a nice warm oversized flannel and the shower on the Cali works perfectly for washing the hair.
The worst night I've had the entire trip was on a campsite. People partying until late, regimented pitches, rules and this particular site was quite close to the motorway so a drone could be heard during the night in the poptop. France is a off grid camping mecca so why not take advantage. And the local people are generally speaking very tolerant of us.

 

[wildslammer22]

Horses for courses. I like the freedom a campervan offers for getting off the beaten track and finding beautiful aires or allocated parking right next to rivers, canals etc. Nothing wrong with a nice warm oversized flannel and the shower on the Cali works perfectly for washing the hair.
The worst night I've had the entire trip was on a campsite. People partying until late, regimented pitches, rules and this particular site was quite close to the motorway so a drone could be heard during the night in the poptop. France is a off grid camping mecca so why not take advantage. And the local people are generally speaking very tolerant of us.

Heading over at the end of the month and that’s my plan too. If the weather is bad we will probably use campsites more, if not then then it’ll be mostly off grid for us.


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[Steve1]

I am certainly guilty of that at times. Much of the media and sadly many of our politicians encourage intolerance and division, more and more we are encouraged to define ourselves by what divides us rather than celebrate what unites us. On this forum we are united as all/mostly Cali owners and I do genuinely believe that the OP was just trying to help the community by way of a warning due his own unpleasant experience. That is community minded and to be celebrated.

Language is important, in that anything which dehumanises people can and does have consequences even if they are invisible to those that use that language at the time. Again the OP didn’t do that but others did by using racial stereotypes in response to the original post.

So what to do, stay quiet, live and let live or challenge and become the paradox? To misquote Burke, bad things can happen when good people do nothing.

This thread despite strong and contrary feelings has been mostly good natured, with only a couple throwing around insults. if it has caused any of us to pause and reconsider the language we use when we interact it’s been worthwhile. I for one shall try to be more respectful of people I disagree with.


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I don't think it has been good natured at all ! Some shocking posts have happened and then been repeated in slightly less inflammatory ways, despite specifically and directly upsetting people and definitely over stepping the mark, so much so that they have since been deleted. I mostly haven't responded and it's not because I think how friendly and tolerant others in here are !
People may be entitled to their opinion as has been repeated many times, but they have to live with how others view them after that.

 

[wildslammer22]

I don't think it has been good natured at all ! Some shocking posts have happened and then been repeated in slightly less inflammatory ways, despite specifically and directly upsetting people and definitely over stepping the mark, so much so that they have since been deleted. I mostly haven't responded and it's not because I think how friendly and tolerant others in here are !
People may be entitled to their opinion as has been repeated many times, but they have to live with how others view them after that.

I would differentiate between views that others might find offensive and civility in debate. My point being that people have in the main disagreed without insulting each other with a few notable exceptions.

One of the points I was trying to make is you can’t hope to persuade people to consider others views and sensitivities if you simply don’t engage. It’s unlikely you’ll change the mind of people that call you pathetic just for having a contrary view but they generally aren’t the majority. They might think they are just because they shout the loudest!


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[Steve1]

I would differentiate between views that others might find offensive and civility in debate. My point being that people have in the main disagreed without insulting each other with a few notable exceptions.

One of the points I was trying to make is you can’t hope to persuade people to consider others views and sensitivities if you simply don’t engage. It’s unlikely you’ll change the mind of people that call you pathetic just for having a contrary view but they generally aren’t the majority. They might think they are just because they shout the loudest!


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They definitely like to shout the loudest.

 

[flying banana]

What I don’t understand is that someone will spend upwards of £80k on a campervan but still don’t want to spend €20 a night at this time of year on a fully serviced pitch with fantastic facilities and lots with a beautiful swimming pool.
We stay on one Aire in Cabarceno Spain which has absolutely no facilities but is right next to a wildlife park with some incredible views. We have stayed here for the past 8 years and feel 100% safe.
on our 3 weeks away we spend less than €450 on campsites which is nothing today.
For those of you that mainly stay on Aires with absolutely no facilities you must be glad to get home and use a toilet and have a shower.

Motor homers are the same. 100k on a van. Then park in a pissy layby all night

 

[CaliforniaSeb]

Also traveling around France. No issues at all finding safe Aires and small allocated parking areas. I do feel more comfortable and sleep sounder if there is at least one other Campervan or Great White nearby. The campsites are used as a last resort and generally just to get a shower and charge up the batteries.

This is our first trip abroad in our camper. So playing it safe at the moment. Stupid question but how do you find these Aires by rivers, canals,other nice locations? Do you just drive until you see one?

 

[Billylou]

We’ve spent a lot on a motorhome from our savings and we use our small pension to park up at night. This might be a free aire, paid for aire or very occasional campsite. We go away for 3 months at a time so we have to watch the budget. Tonight we are on a free aire in Leon enjoying the city. I think it’s an over generalisation to say Motorhomers park in lay-bys as there is plenty of choice. We have stayed on some great aires similar to those described above. Apps such as Search for Sites are a good starting place.

 

[tobyprivett]

I’ll add Park4Night. I find that better for aires, laundry, city parking.

I prefer search4sites for campsites.

 

[GrumpyGranddad]

This is our first trip abroad in our camper. So playing it safe at the moment. Stupid question but how do you find these Aires by rivers, canals,other nice locations? Do you just drive until you see one?

Apart from various Apps, if you know your route and approximate overnight stopping point, it’s good fun to search on Google maps.

That’s how I found these two in Arelaune-en-Seine on a recent trip. The one by the river had the best views and was only €8 per night. The other one, where we stayed, had EHU/toilets/showers/etc. €14 per night.

 

[The Tall Luthier]

We’ve spent a lot on a motorhome from our savings and we use our small pension to park up at night. This might be a free aire, paid for aire or very occasional campsite. We go away for 3 months at a time so we have to watch the budget. Tonight we are on a free aire in Leon enjoying the city. I think it’s an over generalisation to say Motorhomers park in lay-bys as there is plenty of choice. We have stayed on some great aires similar to those described above. Apps such as Search for Sites are a good starting place.

Leon is a great city to visit, we were there in June. If you’re a Culture Vulture you must try their two local delicacies, “Callos” tripe and liquified blood sausage.

If you like tasty food, try a steak instead.

Love the fact that you pay 3€ for a glass of wine and get a free slice of tortilla. Great place

 

[Billylou]

Many thanks @The Tall Luthier. The food is good here, although we haven’t got round to the liquified blood sausage yet, and you are not wrong the wine is really cheap. It’s a great place to visit for a couple of nights.

 

[Wannabecamperman]

Wannabe called me out for a post I made in this thread (#56).

I complained about his choice of language because it trivialised the offence that the P and N words can cause.

It wasn't an attempt to curtail his 'free speech' - it was 'why don't you treat people with a modicum of respect?'

The world has changed - change with it, or spend the rest of your life angry.

Just for clarity, Toby:

1) It was your assuming offence on behalf of others that I commented upon, and my point was that those using the 'N' word are actually often black themselves.

2) As a Christian and a Mason, I absolutely uphold the values of fairness, respect and decency, just as I respect the right to free speech, however offensive some may find it.

3) I'd say disappointed, rather than angry. Social acceptances and tolerances may change, but English standards remain - at least in some quarters of our green and pleasant land.

 

[CaliforniaSeb]

Apart from various Apps, if you know your route and approximate overnight stopping point, it’s good fun to search on Google maps.

That’s how I found these two in Arelaune-en-Seine on a recent trip. The one by the river had the best views and was only €8 per night. The other one, where we stayed, had EHU/toilets/showers/etc. €14 per night.

View attachment 114539

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View attachment 114541

That never occurred to me . Brilliant. Thanks for the tip

 

[Corradobrit]

Heading over at the end of the month and that’s my plan too. If the weather is bad we will probably use campsites more, if not then then it’ll be mostly off grid for us.


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This was last nights prime location along the Bourgogne Canal. And the night before in the parking lot of the Bibracte Archeological Museum, which by the way was a memorable experience. First to visit the award winning architecturally significant museum buildings but also the Gaulish settlement site itself. It was Romanized in the 1st century BC and Julius Caesar over wintered there between 52 and 51BC where he wrote one of his major Treatises.

 

[WelshGas]

This is our first trip abroad in our camper. So playing it safe at the moment. Stupid question but how do you find these Aires by rivers, canals,other nice locations? Do you just drive until you see one?

CAMPING-CAR PARK - The 1st European network of stopover sites and services areas

CAMPING-CAR PARK is the 1st European network of stopover sites and services areas for parking motorhomes in complete peace of mind, 24 hours a day.

www.campingcarpark.com

 

[Corradobrit]

Motor homers are the same. 100k on a van. Then park in a pissy layby all night

See photo above. Definitely no pi$$ detected.