VW Reliability

[dayslikethis]

About to place an order for a new Cali I thought I'd raise a question seeking views? Reading the thread 'out of warranty' in this forum there appears to be quite a high level of issues with Cali's being required to have a range of work done during the early warranty period ranging from mechanical, electrical and of course the paintwork. A general Google search also raises issue with other VW vehicles. Would anyone care to comment before I part with 50K. I know many new cars have issues, welcome a view.

 

[calikev]

Hi there I can understand your concerns there are equally as many vw's that have no problems
Forums never have members posting how reliable their vehicles are you only tend to hear the bad
Bits. In vw's defence their warranty is excellent and many early Cali problems have been ironed out. If you also look at the resale value of a used Cali that tells you something

 

[dayslikethis]

Hi there I can understand your concerns there are equally as many vw's that have no problems
Forums never have members posting how reliable their vehicles are you only tend to hear the bad
Bits. In vw's defence their warranty is excellent and many early Cali problems have been ironed out. If you also look at the resale value of a used Cali that tells you something

Fair comment and appreciated. I would hope there is some update from VW on the blistering issue though. Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Hotel California]

My respond is in the line of Calikev's comment . I have had two land rovers , a renault and now last year a Cali , all of them bought new . All of them had something fixed or replaced under warrenty .
Have heard many story's from friends an collega's , every car/brand have their issues.....
...but how many are flowless compared to te ones you read on the forum .
And replacing something or fixin' a problem under warrenty is a good thing , if the warrenty is expired before the problem comes up you have no support from the dealer. Better use your new car and not leave it at home as long you have warrenty go to the dealer if a problem appears!

 

[Laurence102]

As the owner of a new Cali ( March 2013, ) and one who was also hesitant at buying such an expensive vehicle; given some of the posted topics, I have to say I am delighted. Such a great all round vehicle I am glad my wife and I took the plunge. Yes, we have had a couple of very minor niggles but where they have occurred our dealer has been very supportive and quick to get the fault rectified. That is where I would recommend you do the research and find out how good a reputation your dealer has. In my opinion, much hinges on that. All the very best with your adventure.

 

[dayslikethis]

As the owner of a new Cali ( March 2013, ) and one who was also hesitant at buying such an expensive vehicle; given some of the posted topics, I have to say I am delighted. Such a great all round vehicle I am glad my wife and I took the plunge. Yes, we have had a couple of very minor niggles but where they have occurred our dealer has been very supportive and quick to get the fault rectified. That is where I would recommend you do the research and find out how good a reputation your dealer has. In my opinion, much hinges on that. All the very best with your adventure.

Thanks, grateful for the opinion.

 

[dayslikethis]

My respond is in the line of Calikev's comment . I have had two land rovers , a renault and now last year a Cali , all of them bought new . All of them had something fixed or replaced under warrenty .
Have heard many story's from friends an collega's , every car/brand have their issues.....
...but how many are flowless compared to te ones you read on the forum .
And replacing something or fixin' a problem under warrenty is a good thing , if the warrenty is expired before the problem comes up you have no support from the dealer. Better use your new car and not leave it at home as long you have warrenty go to the dealer if a problem appears!

Many thanks, Ive had my current car from new and now on 140K and never a problem but well serviced and an excellent dealer. It didn't cost 50K though. I look forward to my post when I announce my Cali purchase, just awaiting a final quote from the dealer on spec. Invaluable resource this forum, thank you.

 

[gatvol]

I love the Cali, but the build quality scares me. I need to decide whether to sell it at about 2.5 years old or whether to hold onto it. And I had intended keeping it for 20 years.

Some of the faults occurring within warranty on mine are appalling, plain and simple. Failing electric window motor within 6 months. Bubbling allow wheels at 8000 miles. New instrument binnacle cluster required to replace a single blown bulb. New radio. Bubbling roof. All within 18 months. This is like a 1970s fiat, not the vw I once knew.

I have owned a series of vw and Audis since 1989. Taking in mk 1, 2 and 3 golfs and jettas. Audi A3, Audi 80s and Audi s5. The build today is rubbish compared to products made in the mid 70s, 80s and up to the mid 90s. I gave benefit of the doubt on my S5. I saw the trouble my friends were having with mid to late noughties diesel a6 avant, RS4, R8, TT ... The Cali has ended my brand loyalty now.

Having also owned a 4.6l 2002 range rover p38 with the infamous air suspension I would say that the Cali is in this league in terms of reliability. If you buy one, love it for its unique character but know that it is a ticking time bomb.

The car warranty companies tell the real story of car reliability in glorious technicolor. People may say that some Cali owners have been unlucky. Well maybe I have. And maybe they think I was also unlucky with my Audi s5.

But look at the league tables on warranty direct and I have not actually been unlucky at all. I have experienced first hand the seemingly very deliberate policy of the German manufacturers to cut costs, reduce build quality, design gorgeous cars with massive showroom appeal... and hope people think they are still reliable and hope that they will buy another one even though they now offer below average to really quite bad reliability. And in the meantime make a mint out of expensive parts and labour costs.

http://www.reliabilityindex.com/manufacturer

VW is rated 22nd worst out of 39. Audi is 34th worst out of 39. Mercedes, Porsche, BMW have all done the same thing. I own a 1994 merc sl (rag top) which is recognised as being one of the best engineered and built cars ever made. It's replacement model came out in about 2002 (retractable hard top) and is listed as the 6th worst car for reliability that was covered by warranty direct. You can see this with your own eyes in terms of the quality of the materials used.

Indeed the worst ten cars covered by this survey are all Audis, Mercs, BMW, Bentley, Porsche.

http://www.reliabilityindex.com/

German cars are still seen by the public as reliable, as since the Beetle came here they progressively developed an enviable reputation for build quality. But the impartial facts, and my personal experience over 25 years, and the experience of numerous friends says they no longer are. If you want reliable nowadays, you buy Japanese. If you buy a Cali, love it, and pray. And know that you currently still get good residuals if your nerve goes as the end of the warranty period approaches.

 

[daz60]

I, am concerned with the reliability of my 3 week old California, I have rusty bolts on the elevating roof arms also a lose bolt stopping the roof coming down evenly. Rust on the bottom sliding door runner and blemishes in the paint work on the bonnet. Also when I open the tailgate in the wet water runs onto the mattress

 

[Calincolnshire]

Not being funny but this reliability index is flawed. Skoda is in the top 10 and has exactly the same parts / engine etc etc as its audi / vw / seat counterparts. The skoda gets rave reviews from its owners . Can the factory it's bolted together make all the differeace or is it an owners perception that differ brand o brand. They do sell more VW's than skoda but the percentage of issues should be the same.
My audi 60k miles so far and my mini before that 80k have been trouble free, my fathers skoda likewise, however my ford galaxy's were shocking with gearbox issues. It's a lottery the reliability game so buy the vehicle you want as that's what warranties are for.

 

[gatvol]

I think this is a very fair challenge. Minicab drivers are often a good guide. Near me they use skodas.

I have wondered how this can be the case and my conclusion was that for volume cars, vw may still get it ok. IE golf with 4 cylinder engine, diesel a4 2 litre..... But when you stray into low volume or specialist - TT v6, S5 v8, R8, RS range, Touareg V10, cali ..... It all seems to go wrong.

The cali combines a commodity engine and body with bespoke low volume interior. Yet commodity parts on my cali still failed - electric window, alloy wheel paint, basic radio, instrument cluster lighting. Bespoke parts of my cali also failed - water gauge, roof paint bubbling.

The same happened with my S5. A mix of usual a5 (intelligent key, fuel cap solenoid, ac fan) and v8 specific (Clutch thrust bearing, starter relays, water pump, radiator fan). The backbreaker for me was that a common fault is drivers door lock becoming inoperable when it snows. My garage could do nothing. Unbelievable.

 

[Custardtart]

It seems that the premium marques generally rate lower - I wonder if this is affected by customer expectations?

I know that I've got a seat rattle in my Cali at the moment - a replacement is on order. I don't expect a rattly seat in my premium campervan. I doubt they get many seats changed for rattling in the builders van version of the T5.

Of course, if a clutch, egr, gearbox etc fails then it fails.

Just a thought.

 

[RodCouncil]

I hired a 12 plate Cali this weekend for a sortie around Wales with my MTB, and although the vehicle will havce a decent turn over of numpties like me, the general fit and finish doesn't add to 50k in my mind.

The small things I noticed was the amount of faff to even get the captains seats to swivel, I'm sure you would get quick at this over time, but the lumps out of the door fascia is noticable.

Cabinet doors catches on the kitchen are already looking worse for wear and those tiny plastic hinges for the shelves don't look durable to me, the roof has small tears around the hinge section albeit alievated now the bungee trick just smacks of VW should make these things idiot proof.

On the mechanical side I need to test a 2.5 174 motor now as the 180 biT does nothing for me and the suspension and ride quality just seemed very crashy and this is someone coming from a Lotus Elise on Nitrons.

Love them to bits tho and we have one more hire in Oct, after that I'll know exactly what I want from one.

 

[James]

I think there a number of things that come into play regarding this issue.

I think the first issues is simply expectation. People, rightly or wrongly think the more they spend on a vehicle the better it should be. This is two way, for the car makers they are happy to encourage this and for the buyer it probably offsets pangs of guilt at spending 40 - 50k on a vehicle, or at least it is a comforter.

This notion is ridiculous, not helped by the fact that a more expensive car is more complex and therefore more likely to have a problem. And that is the other issue, these days nothing is simple on a car, it's not a case of changing a speedo - it's a case of the whole cluster out and that is expensive.

Skoda's do well because people think, hey, it hasn't gone wrong and it is reliable. German marques do badly because basically people can't understand where the extra cash they have spent has gone. Yes they might have higher grade plastics or materials but really you've bought a badge and if you've done that, then sadly you may be let down.

No one should expect a car to go wrong or accept it but whether the Cali is unreliable I think no, no more than any other car/vehicle. Is it fragile and full of bits that can go wrong, yes, and no matter how much money you spend, there is no guarantee against that.

If you think that is unacceptable and you'd be perfectly entitled to think so, then don't buy one. The basic premise is, the 7k Dacia you see advertised on the TV is probably no more unreliable or problematic then you 40k+ vehicle.

Price guarantees nothing.

James

 

[beardie]

Given that VW use standard building blocks that they share with audi, seat, skoda etc then the more features a vehicle has then the more often one of them will fail. Otherwise the reliability of the individual blocks needs to rise with the number fitted to any vehicle.

The expectation of the consumer is that a vehicle that is expensive has more toys that are more complex and is more reliable. The laws of economics and statistics tell you that unless the money has gone into expensive plastics, materials etc then vehicles that are more complex will fail more often.

Therefore simple / cheap skoda's are 'more reliable' than expensive campervans

 

[James]

Given that VW use standard building blocks that they share with audi, seat, skoda etc then the more features a vehicle has then the more often one of them will fail. Otherwise the reliability of the individual blocks needs to rise with the number fitted to any vehicle.

The expectation of the consumer is that a vehicle that is expensive has more toys that are more complex and is more reliable. The laws of economics and statistics tell you that unless the money has gone into expensive plastics, materials etc then vehicles that are more complex will fail more often.

Therefore simple / cheap skoda's are 'more reliable' than expensive campervans

Well put

James

 

[Calincolnshire]

Given that VW use standard building blocks that they share with audi, seat, skoda etc then the more features a vehicle has then the more often one of them will fail. Otherwise the reliability of the individual blocks needs to rise with the number fitted to any vehicle.

The expectation of the consumer is that a vehicle that is expensive has more toys that are more complex and is more reliable. The laws of economics and statistics tell you that unless the money has gone into expensive plastics, materials etc then vehicles that are more complex will fail more often.

Therefore simple / cheap skoda's are 'more reliable' than expensive campervans

Not sure i agree to some of the above. For one the reliability index from warranty companies will not include the Cali and certainly not habitation issues. Yes the Cali is more complex but the issues reported by members of this forum are the fundamental building blocks of all VW group vehicles . So engines gearboxes , DPF, etc. are common. We do own complex vehicles so we may well have more issues however it still does not answer why a Octavia is more reliable than a golf according to the poles. Go on the skoda website their cars have just as many bells and whistles as any VW and for less money.
Reliability could well be as easy as quantum physics to understand. I am sure the Germans will quote some six sigma stats to us all if we were to question them directly.

My 2013 Cali going in for crunching gears between 1st and 2nd but I will only be miffed if they cannot fix it. Sat outside it with a glass of wine and I will forget any issues. Also what's the alternative a Mazda bongo or Hyundai i800. Does anyone think the new Trani will be any better and all for the same money as a Cali. I do agree all manufacturers are cutting costs at our expense but as I have stated the alternatives are less apealing.

At least one thing is clear if enough people make a noise about something VW Listen . So well done to those that have hassled VW into doing something about roof paintwork "eventually"

John

 

[fredster]

Well, interested by this thread I've just spent an hour or two googling "car reliabilty" and which ever survey you peruse - Reliablity Index, JD Power, Which Car, Auto Express, etc - its not good reading for a VW owner. Not a good showing in ANY of them.

For a company that once used the tagline "If only everything in life was as reliable as a Volkswagen" things seemed to have slipped somewhat.

 

[James]

Well, interested by this thread I've just spent an hour or two googling "car reliabilty" and which ever survey you peruse - Reliablity Index, JD Power, Which Car, Auto Express, etc - its not good reading for a VW owner. Not a good showing in ANY of them.

For a company that once used the tagline "If only everything in life was as reliable as a Volkswagen" things seemed to have slipped somewhat.

My Beach has been reliable touch (Beach) wood.

I think some of the plastics are cheap and the glovebox seems to be compiled of sections which were clearly not designed together.

But - I didn't buy it for its build quality

James

 

[briwy]

Well perhaps we all ought to rush out and buy one of the last Brazilian T2s, assuming they have not been "modernised" at least we could mend them ourselves without a computer.

I have been fortunate to have had a company car for the last 35 years and can honestly say that apart from a Saab that had everything wrong with it and a Peugeot that caught fire I have had very little trouble.
The best of them all have been Skodas, I got fed up paying a lot of benefit in kind tax for fancy cars that after a few years I didn't own. My better half bought a Fabia VRs when they first came out about eight or nine years ago and I was so impressed with the build quality that I went for Octavias Estates as company cars. Colleagues at work rolled on the floor laughing until their expensive BMWs started blowing turbos and other problems. Since then we have had four Skodas, the only problem being one with a dodgy dual mass flywheel that ate the gearbox, also a Passat Sport all doing around 130k miles with just routine servicing. So, as already mentioned, the basic bits are all out of the same parts bins.As the Transporter is supposed to be the worlds best selling van they must be doing something right so personally I'm not too worried about the basic vehicle, I think VW have got on the bandwagon with the Cali and possibly not lived up to their previous reputation. Perhaps would have been better leaving the conversions to Westfalia. Fortunately the camper bits of the Cali aren't linked into the Canbus which means that everything could at a pinch be rewired with simple on/off switches rather than the overhead display.
I agree that stuff like the blistering paint is unforgivable for any company nowadays but like most companies they are run by bean counters rather than engineers.

 

[KernowLad]

Having owned many VWs over the years, I am convinced they aren't as reliable as they once were.

 

[TwentyOneThirtyFive]

Well perhaps we all ought to rush out and buy one of the last Brazilian T2s, assuming they have not been "modernised" at least we could mend them ourselves without a computer.

They were modernised. 1.4s from the Polo I think.