California v T5 conversions

[steerpike]

Hi,

I'm sure this is a regular topic so apologies if already answered many times over but...

I had a T5 Transporter conversion on a 2012 plate and pretty high spec. I loved it but sold because of a relationship break up and the memories associated with that specific van.

I now have my nose proverbially pressed against the window at Californias. Clearly it's a matter of personal taste but can anyone highlight the major differences? I guess there's so many T5 conversions that this may be a daft question.

I suppose with a California, you get some peace of mind in respect of quality of fixtures and of warranty. Are there any obvious other reasons why a California trumps a quality T5 conversion?

I understand most have a built in heater but I'm wondering how a solar conversion might work on a Call as I'd want to off grid quite a bit. Is the leisure battery compartment roomy? I'd like the most powerful battery I can fit in there.

Thanks

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[MattBW]

For me the major difference is everything is factory and everything is covered under the same warranty (if you have one). Generally the snagging and issues that can be a pain on a new conversion such as cutting the roof hole isn't there on a Cali as the body is designed to take the roof from new. If you do have any issues its all resolved in the same place.

The disadvantage is they are all generally the same so you any personalisation will be down to extras really.

Are you looking for a Beach or an Ocean, the answers will differ slightly? Beach has 1 leisure battery the Ocean/SE two. Generally 150ah of battery on the Ocean.

Lots of good threads on here about solar and @Roger Donoghue is one the forum sponsors and offers a kit that will bolt onto the Cali roof rails without modification.

 

[johnyboy]

I can only tell you the main reasons we opted for a Cali over conversion
1) Depreciation - there will always be a market for Calis, at a good price, vs any conversion, if I needed to get as much money out of a van as quickly as possible then a Cali would win.
2) Blinds - hate curtains
3) Table and chair stowage - you save room vs having to have them yourself
4) Drive - most of the other conversions I tried sounded like a tractor and did not handle as smoothly

There were many niggles I had with other conversions (not always universal) like inverters on show, table poles clipped in, carpeted panels/roof (been there done that on my own conversions), massively visible pop tops heavy wooden interiors.

 

[Verity]

Calis don't have carpet on the walls. Yuk! Also fridge placement in lots of convos meant that the driver's seat wouldn't swivel, plus you couldn't open the fridge when the downstairs bed was made up. Table and chairs provision in the Cali is an excellent space saver. I think what's been said above about it all being made by one manufacturer - mind you, a lot on here are having trouble with that one manufacturer over niggles, so nothing's perfect!

 

[ArunAlec]

I went through decision stage Cali vs Conversion and the only thing that made me hesitate over going for the Cali (bearing in mind I was buying use) was the robustness of conversions. The California is not for the heavy handed! It does need treating with respect........ as I apparently keep telling my partner!

 

[Stuart]

One obvious difference is you get the sliding door on the drivers side, which may or may not be an advantage to you. Personally I prefer it being on the drivers side.

Also having the rear seat on rails is great if you actually use the back seats for carrying people, as you can slide it forward for driving and slide it back for camping use.

For us (2 adults & 2 kids) I think the Cali is better than a conversion, but if it wasn't for the kids I would probably get a bespoke conversion and not worry about carrying people in the back.

 

[MarkVw2017]

Residuals and having the confidence its made in a VW factory!

 

[Ocean Spirit]

To add or agree with the above posts
Kitchen is on the best side (if you are not talking beach).
Double glazing
Homogeny (blinds, gas bottle storage, camping table & chairs etc)
In most cases, power to weight ratio,
Even the top opener fridge is a triumph. I kind of wanted a door on the front until I used the top loader.

 

[Ryemslie]

Cali is registered as a car whereas I believe a conversion is a van so has speed restrictions over a cali

 

[MarkVw2017]

Cali is registered as a car whereas I believe a conversion is a van.

Until you put rear windows and rear seats in, its then classed as a car as well, especially from a HMRC perspective.

 

[WelshGas]

Until you put rear windows and rear seats in, its then classed as a car as well, especially from a HMRC perspective.

If the conversion is based on a Commercial N1 Vehicle then it doesn’t matter how many windows or seats are fitted then it is still N1 Commercial . If it outfitted to DVLA’s standard for a MotorCaravan the the Body Type can be amended and N1 Commercial speed restrictions no longer apply.. A conversion could be based on a Caravelle which has a DVLA Classification of M1 Diesel Car A’s is the California.

 

[WelshGas]

It is very, very difficult to get the Base Vehicle you actually want in a Conversion, especially if you want new, unless you buy the van you want with all the goodies you want before handing it to a converter.

 

[MarkVw2017]

If the conversion is based on a Commercial N1 Vehicle then it doesn’t matter how many windows or seats are fitted then it is still N1 Commercial . If it outfitted to DVLA’s standard for a MotorCaravan the the Body Type can be amended and N1 Commercial speed restrictions no longer apply.. A conversion could be based on a Caravelle which has a DVLA Classification of M1 Diesel Car A’s is the California.

Thats fair enough, but please note, you couldnt put it through the books via a business or reclaim vat as the HMRC would class it as a car rather than a van, even though the log book says a Van, it would attract benefit in kind and that would be a horrible tax to pay on a t5/t6 ;-0 if you buy it outright however, for personal use, not via business, ignore the above!!

 

[2into1]

and having the confidence its made in a VW factory!

Yeah! (not).
The Cali does everything a little better than everything else (deckchairs and table stored 'for free', waste water tank the same, fresh water tank doesn't take up a whole cupboard because its a hugely difficult moulding beyond any converter etc etc)
BUT, it's fragile, needs to be fixed by VW who are muppets on the camping side, it can't be fixed on a camping site, parts can't be replaced at any caravan shop or b&q.... Where conversions can be. (edit, Cali faults aren't fixed, they are replaced).
If you look at the construction of the rear cupboard (from the boot) then you'll understand totally what I mean. The tambour door is wafer thin vs a conversion, but it's easily broken and will be broken by a child. The hinges are a thing of beauty, but horrendously complex and expensive.

If it wasn't for the resale value and ease of resale, I'd be in a conversion (that incorporated everything I've learned in 15 of vw ownership). As things stand, I'm sticking with Cali's.

 

[MarkVw2017]

Yeah! (not).
The Cali does everything a little better than everything else (deckchairs and table stored 'for free', waste water tank the same, fresh water tank doesn't take up a whole cupboard because its a hugely difficult moulding beyond any converter etc etc)
BUT, it's fragile, needs to be fixed by VW who are muppets on the camping side, it can't be fixed on a camping site, parts can't be replaced at any caravan shop or b&q.... Where conversions can be. (edit, Cali faults aren't fixed, they are replaced).
If you look at the construction of the rear cupboard (from the boot) then you'll understand totally what I mean. The tambour door is wafer thin vs a conversion, but it's easily broken and will be broken by a child. The hinges are a thing of beauty, but horrendously complex and expensive.

If it wasn't for the resale value and ease of resale, I'd be in a conversion (that incorporated everything I've learned in 15 of vw ownership). As things stand, I'm sticking with Cali's.

Wow, not feeling the VW cali love with that post. Sell it then, and use the money for hotels and cruise's, even easier ;-)

 

[2into1]

Wow, not feeling the VW cali love with that post. Sell it then, and use the money for hotels and cruise's, even easier ;-)

What in my post makes you think I'd be interested in hotels and cruises? We are simply debating the merits of two choices of campers.

Edit: and with perfect timing, this thread has been resurrected tonight!
https://vwcaliforniaclub.com/threads/rear-tambour-door.1498/

 

[Velma's Dad]

On the 'fragility' question - I'd agree with 2into1 and others that the Cali cupboardry is potentially delicate, versus a bunch of 12mm chipboard and Hafele fittings in a convo anyway. But in practice it's probably only really vulnerable if you're a bit heavy-handed generally (no disgrace in that, some people just are) or, more crucially, if you travel with young children..

Actually, a friend who has a conversion showed me the box of various spare hardware bits and pieces he keeps in the van and often has to resort to. He asked me if I carried something similar and looked at me a bit oddly when I said no, I just haven't needed to (so far). Apart from gaffer tape of course for the tambour door.

I do still get a kick out of the general Club Class-ness of the Cali interior, for me it's a real plus over wall carpet etc.

 

[Erbster]

We have had our Ocean for 16 months, to replace our T5 Bilbo’s conversion. The Cali actually comes in cheaper if you want the extras that you have to pay for on a conversion. Add that to the residual and VW responsible for everything and it’s a no brainer. Was very happy with my old T5 and said I would replace with same, but when it came to it, the Cali was our choice. No regrets so far...

 

[soulstyledevon]

I’ve yet to see a conversion that’s anywhere near as good as a California.
There are a couple of good guys converting, but there are more bad. I have a few friends with converted vans, not cheap either. Couple in excess of £30k and I honestly think they are dreadful...!!!
Tired vans, poor workmanship and cheap materials.

Some of the roofs...
Blimey, cut and shunt springs to mind.
I’ve converted a couple of vans myself over the years and did a far far better job than some of these so called conversion companies.

California all day long for me.
Just wish they made a manual roof version.

 

[MattBW]

I havent found the beach to be fragile at all, quite the opposite.

 

[larrylamb]

A Cali whilst not individual like many conversions and "bought not made" (yawn) has some major plus points for me.
High end base vehicle, Excellent beds top and bottom, sliding rear seat, kitchen/water tank arrangement, window blinds, interior finish/panels, table and chairs storage and residuals.

 

[B J G]

Only plus I can find for quality conversions is if buying second hand then roof corrosion issue of California may be avoided.

 

[Elmo3]

We considered a few when looking at Calis. Frankly, the price of anything vaguely decent is the same, if not more than a Cali, but not as good. They are often based on poor spec 102 engined vans as well. Unless you are really desperate for something personalised I just don’t see the point. The only alternative we would consider if we wanted a different layout (and loo..) would be the Club Joker City.

 

[ArunAlec]

I havent found the beach to be fragile at all, quite the opposite.

I guess that's one of the arguments for the Beach over the SE. It hasn't got the kitchen/furniture components that, in my opinion, need treating with care. Swings and roundabouts!

 

[Ocean Spirit]

I’ve yet to see a conversion that’s anywhere near as good as a California.
There are a couple of good guys converting, but there are more bad. I have a few friends with converted vans, not cheap either. Couple in excess of £30k and I honestly think they are dreadful...!!!
Tired vans, poor workmanship and cheap materials.

Some of the roofs...
Blimey, cut and shunt springs to mind.
I’ve converted a couple of vans myself over the years and did a far far better job than some of these so called conversion companies.

California all day long for me.
Just wish they made a manual roof version.

I tend to agree that you really have to be careful with a conversion.
There are a lot of people out there that think they are doing a good job but I'd be very careful in my selection of conversion company so it bodes well for choosing the California.