How about using the water tank in winter

[dctrl]

Hi,
I m new to California but have now been using one every day for work and leisure, as my only vehicle.

now winter is coming. I m used to use the water system every other day on average. What do I do to keep doing that, not freezing it?

even when heating the van, inside cupboards it is really cold!

Also when camping sometimes you’re away hiking for hours, even days, having parked the van outside in cold weather?

I find threads about draining the system, but that’s for when not using the van/system.

many thanks on you’re thoughts,
Dieter

 

[GrannyJen]

I've never emptied my water tank but then my Cali was in use throughout all winters.

If the van is going to be kept warm then the tank should not freeze, especially if in very cold conditions you opened the rear cupboards to allow the warm air to circulate around the tank.

If it get's very, very cold, ice, frost, snow and snowmen with frozen snowballs and the vehicle was going to be idle for a few days with no heat in it then I might think again but in 8 years it's never happened.

The parked up in cold weather and off out hiking scenario is easily solved, leave the heating ticking over. So much nicer anyway to come home to a nice warm van and the diesel heater is very frugal.

 

[WelshGas]

Hi,
I m new to California but have now been using one every day for work and leisure, as my only vehicle.

now winter is coming. I m used to use the water system every other day on average. What do I do to keep doing that, not freezing it?

even when heating the van, inside cupboards it is really cold!

Also when camping sometimes you’re away hiking for hours, even days, having parked the van outside in cold weather?

I find threads about draining the system, but that’s for when not using the van/system.

many thanks on you’re thoughts,
Dieter

As has been said - leave heating on Low and rear cupboards open + kitchen cupboard for waste tank.

If you are really concerned you can get 12v heating pads to stick on the tank.

Or you can use a non-toxic antifreeze for drinking water systems made for boats/campervans/motorhomes.

Domestic Antifreeze for Drinking Water Systems

Non-toxic antifreeze for the domestic water system on board boats and RVs. Antifreeze protects the potable water system from damaged caused by freezing water.

www.asap-supplies.com

Other makes available.

 

[dctrl]

Thanks,

I've never emptied my water tank but then my Cali was in use throughout all winters.

If the van is going to be kept warm then the tank should not freeze, especially if in very cold conditions you opened the rear cupboards to allow the warm air to circulate around the tank.

If it get's very, very cold, ice, frost, snow and snowmen with frozen snowballs and the vehicle was going to be idle for a few days with no heat in it then I might think again but in 8 years it's never happened.

The parked up in cold weather and off out hiking scenario is easily solved, leave the heating ticking over. So much nicer anyway to come home to a nice warm van and the diesel heater is very frugal.

and @WelshGas

That's exactly how I tend to use it. Overnight cupboards open. It is in everyday use, but luckily, when at home, it is parked indoors.
Last newyears eve I thought to see some of them snowmen with frozen snowballs in all kinds of moving colors on top of Les Vosgues, but then when I looked at the temp reading it said 8°C! No freezing involved

Thanks for advice!

 

[California4x4]

Hi,
I m new to California but have now been using one every day for work and leisure, as my only vehicle.

now winter is coming. I m used to use the water system every other day on average. What do I do to keep doing that, not freezing it?

even when heating the van, inside cupboards it is really cold!

Also when camping sometimes you’re away hiking for hours, even days, having parked the van outside in cold weather?

I find threads about draining the system, but that’s for when not using the van/system.

many thanks on you’re thoughts,
Dieter

When living in my van in Norway. Down to -6 I was able to keep the tank from freezing. Below that, I left the water tank empty and used a 15L container with a tap on it instead of the water system.

 

[KGCali]

You could always add some Vodka to the water as an antifreeze
If camping below -5C for a few day I just drain down the water system and keep a water container in the van.
Don't forget to add some antifreeze to your toilet system water as well

 

[WelshGas]

You could always add some Vodka to the water as an antifreeze
If camping below -5C for a few day I just drain down the water system and keep a water container in the van.
Don't forget to add some antifreeze to your toilet system water as well

You can get an Antifreeze additive for Drinking water systems.

 

[KGCali]

You can get an Antifreeze additive for Drinking water systems.

Yes but I thought Vodka may be more fun

 

[WelshGas]

Yes but I thought Vodka may be more fun

Camping Yes, driving not so sure.

 

[dctrl]

Thank you, I'll try the wodka first!
That seems like a must when down to -5 anyways.

 

[sbmcd]

After 8 years of using my van for winter camping while skiing I've never had an issue with water freezing, normally just leave the cupboard doors open and run the heater.

I was up at Cairngorm ski touring at the beginning of the week, unfortunately the sustained very low temps circa minus 11 finally froze the half full water tank and pump.

Still waiting on in thawing but has anyone else experienced this as I'd like to know the likelihood of the pump being damaged by the ice.

 

[WelshGas]

After 8 years of using my van for winter camping while skiing I've never had an issue with water freezing, normally just leave the cupboard doors open and run the heater.

I was up at Cairngorm ski touring at the beginning of the week, unfortunately the sustained very low temps circa minus 11 finally froze the half full water tank and pump.

Still waiting on in thawing but has anyone else experienced this as I'd like to know the likelihood of the pump being damaged by the ice.

View attachment 103172

Unlikely, but not impossible. The pump is open ended so the ice does have the room to expand .

 

[sbmcd]

Unlikely, but not impossible. The pump is open ended so the ice does have the room to expand .

Fingers crossed, I'll report back once it thaws.

 

[Hawthorn37]

After 8 years of using my van for winter camping while skiing I've never had an issue with water freezing, normally just leave the cupboard doors open and run the heater.

I was up at Cairngorm ski touring at the beginning of the week, unfortunately the sustained very low temps circa minus 11 finally froze the half full water tank and pump.

Still waiting on in thawing but has anyone else experienced this as I'd like to know the likelihood of the pump being damaged by the ice.

View attachment 103172

As the pump is surrounded by water (or ice in your case), the pressure of the expanding ice will be equalised inside and out, so the pump should be fine. I’d take a look at the piping from the pump though - although as it’s plastic it might have a bit of give and be okay.

Please report back !

 

[sbmcd]

As the pump is surrounded by water (or ice in your case), the pressure of the expanding ice will be equalised inside and out, so the pump should be fine. I’d take a look at the piping from the pump though - although as it’s plastic it might have a bit of give and be okay.

Please report back !

Thanks, I will

 

[Cali Phillip]

I was heading out the next day on work in the van with an early start and wanted water in the tank, it was going to be -4c over night so had the park heater on timer every few hours and electric heater on frost setting in case and the wardrobe door was open.
I happened to be taking our test temperature instrument back to work which I set up a test to monitor the air temperature above the heater tank and in the boot every hour.
What I found was the water tank temperature stayed around 2C and was fine but the surprise was the boot which got down in the range of -2C to -3.5C.
Just shows that the boor is well insulated from the cabin by the bench seat and mattress.
Maybe to help the tank temperature the ski hatch next to the table would allow warm air into the boot.

I have now ordered a long range blue tooth thermometer which will be installed next to the water tank.
Does look like the outside of the tank could have a layer of closed cell insulation sheet slide down while still allowing moisture to escape and or a heat pad.

 

[Ozzy Pete]

Emptied all the water tanks, always do in the winter but forgot about the old porta Potti. Absolutely frozen solid. Took 2 days to defrost but seems to be unharmed by the wintery experience.

 

[Cali Phillip]

Emptied all the water tanks, always do in the winter but forgot about the old porta Potti. Absolutely frozen solid. Took 2 days to defrost but seems to be unharmed by the wintery experience.

Yes I do too, unless its prolonged low temps under freezing for days as the vans camped in every week. Remembered the porta potty ! and took it out as use bog in bag in the top the rare times we have to use it, WelshGas was right !

 

[sbmcd]

As the pump is surrounded by water (or ice in your case), the pressure of the expanding ice will be equalised inside and out, so the pump should be fine. I’d take a look at the piping from the pump though - although as it’s plastic it might have a bit of give and be okay.

Please report back !

Finally managed to thaw out the tank and pump today. Took the gas cylinder out and put two hot water bottles in a plastic bag into the gas cylinder space and closed lid.

Once thawed I added 10 litres of hot water from the house hot tap to the van tank to ensure the pump was fully thawed.

Finally replaced the blown 5 amp fuse under the passenger seat.

All now fully operational thankfully.

 

[sbmcd]

I was heading out the next day on work in the van with an early start and wanted water in the tank, it was going to be -4c over night so had the park heater on timer every few hours and electric heater on frost setting in case and the wardrobe door was open.
I happened to be taking our test temperature instrument back to work which I set up a test to monitor the air temperature above the heater tank and in the boot every hour.
What I found was the water tank temperature stayed around 2C and was fine but the surprise was the boot which got down in the range of -2C to -3.5C.
Just shows that the boor is well insulated from the cabin by the bench seat and mattress.
Maybe to help the tank temperature the ski hatch next to the table would allow warm air into the boot.

I have now ordered a long range blue tooth thermometer which will be installed next to the water tank.
Does look like the outside of the tank could have a layer of closed cell insulation sheet slide down while still allowing moisture to escape and or a heat pad.

like the idea of the Bluetooth thermometer to keep an eye on the tank temperature. And yes it does look like some thin insulation could be said between the outer wall and the tank, will investigate that more.

Judging by the cold draft that comes through the ski hatch when it's removed I think the chances of heat going the other way is slim

 

[The Blue Merle]

After 8 years of using my van for winter camping while skiing I've never had an issue with water freezing, normally just leave the cupboard doors open and run the heater.

I was up at Cairngorm ski touring at the beginning of the week, unfortunately the sustained very low temps circa minus 11 finally froze the half full water tank and pump.

Still waiting on in thawing but has anyone else experienced this as I'd like to know the likelihood of the pump being damaged by the ice.

View attachment 103172

Froze my tanks a few times in the joker and Cali no issues with pump but did take a few days unfreeze.

 

[Denzilgts]

The tank froze on the Cali, blown the 5amp fuse. Removed the main access point lid , took all the icebergs out …. Found the water supply feed line had came off the water pump itself. had To pull the pump out and slowly warm up, the pimp itself. On the bottom of the pump, turned the mechanisim until it freed itself.

tested once more , now working well

 

[Cali Phillip]

like the idea of the Bluetooth thermometer to keep an eye on the tank temperature. And yes it does look like some thin insulation could be said between the outer wall and the tank, will investigate that more.

Judging by the cold draft that comes through the ski hatch when it's removed I think the chances of heat going the other way is slim

this was what `I have ordered, has alarms too, hopefully it works in the house so can monitor the mitigation heating strategy https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08SQS74XP/?tag=eliteelect-21

 

[sbmcd]

this was what `I have ordered, has alarms too, hopefully it works in the house so can monitor the mitigation heating strategy https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B08SQS74XP/?tag=eliteelect-21

Any thoughts on how to fix it to the tank, can't really put it in with the gas bottle as that will cool when the cooker is in use.

 

[Cali Phillip]

Any thoughts on how to fix it to the tank, can't really put it in with the gas bottle as that will cool when the cooker is in use.

Not really got that far, the idea was to mount it on top of the tank probably with some velcro so it can be removed from the tank top.